deimos3428 wrote:This is going to take more head-banging that I can afford at the moment
MetamorphosisSigma wrote:Let me preface what I'm about to post by acknowledging that I'm coming to this discussion late, so please let me know if I'm covering old ground or if I am misunderstanding the issues involved..One of my Monster Manuals appears to be a red 4th, per this description:1. (as TheMilford asked) It does NOT have the yellow and red sewn binding as the other "4th Red" 2. States "Distributed to the book trade in the United States by Random House..." on the title page, as in your "4th White" 3. Hydra illustration is raised, as in your "4th White" 4. There are no prices shown and the spacing looks exactly the same between "Star Probe" and "Star Empires" as in your "4th White" EDIT: 5. Also, there's an ISBN on the bottom of the title page HOWEVER, I measured the distance between stitches and found that it is 5/8", not 1" as someone stated it should be, above. I'm not sure if this is noteworthy or not, but figured I might as well chime in. I can provide pictures if needed.
MetamorphosisSigma wrote:Okay, bearing with... Have the MM handy. EDIT: Okay, so far I'm a 4th Beta, except that I measure the stiches at 5/8" apart, which contradicts this:MMs: 1st - 5/8" 2nd - 3/8" 3rd/3rd plus - 5/8" 4th (red) - 1" 4th (white) - 1" 5th - 1 1/4" 6th - ?? 7th - glued
deimos3428 wrote:In light of this evidence, I move that the 4th Beta/Gamma be listed as 5th Alpha/Beta, with the original 5th now a 5th Gamma. I see no other reasonable solution.
SimperingToad wrote:As per the comment on the 1st print MM description, Random House had always been the printer/distributor (unless I'm reading that incorrectly).
deimos3428 wrote:Now, going back full circle to page one of the thread: Can the owners of this proposed new 5th Alpha/Beta tell us whether the "errata" is present/absent? This may help confirm the ordering of the printings (or not).
MetamorphosisSigma wrote:My "4th Beta" (5th Alpha/Beta?) also incorporates all of the errata listed there, with the exception of this item:"Giant: The sentence about giant strength found in the introduction should read, "All giants are very strong, with strengths ranging from 19 to 24 as compared to humans." emphasis mineIn contrast, my "4th Beta" (5th Alpha/Beta) reads:"All giants are very strong, with strengths ranging from 19 to 25 as compared to humans." emphasis mineBUT, I also checked my 5th (later 5th, that is) for this sentence, and it ALSO states "25" as opposed to "24". Therefore I'm guessing this is simply an error in the MM errata section of the Acaeum, rather than a piece of errata included in The Dragon #35. Easy enough to check! Getting my TD #35 now......Okay, the errata in TD #35 reads exactly as the Acaeum MM errata page ("19 to 24"), so this either means this particular piece of errata was never incorporated into an actual printing, or it was done after my 5th print. Can someone check that? The latest printing I have is 5th.
MetamorphosisSigma wrote:My "4th Beta" (5th Alpha/Beta?) also incorporates all of the errata listed there, with the exception of this item:
"Giant: The sentence about giant strength found in the introduction should read, "All giants are very strong, with strengths ranging from 19 to 24 as compared to humans." emphasis mineIn contrast, my "4th Beta" (5th Alpha/Beta) reads:"All giants are very strong, with strengths ranging from 19 to 25 as compared to humans." emphasis mine
deimos3428 wrote:What it states in Dragon 35 is correct; I do not know if it made it into the books or not. Only Titans have 25 STR.