Centurion13 wrote:This is the original art from the cover of Dragon Magazine #12.  What do you folks think?  Worth something?

[ Image ][ Image ]

Centurion13

Very cool!!

Just a suggestion, get a second and third opinion before you even consider selling it...otherwise you may regret it.

-PD

I'm betting you would get at least $500 for it if you put it on ebay and advertized it here.

Well, I WAS going to sell it to Scott for $175, but it has been over two weeks since he said he'd mailed the money order, and he doesn't seem anxious to return my emails....so I've nixed the deal.  If by chance the money does roll in, I will return it to him unopened.

$500?  That's a bit of change, what?  The painting is in inks and color pencil and a splash of watercolor (don't quote me on this).  

Do miniatures count as art?

Regards,

Centurion13

Thanks for the heads-up, Hal . . . .

Well, the last two vintage TSR covers that I sold were about two years ago. I sold the Roslof cover for "Queen of the Demonweb Pits" for $1500 and the cover for "Descent into the Depths of the Earth" for $2000. So you can kinda figure from there . . . . naturally, this piece is neither as important nor as well rendered as either of those pieces, but it oughta help everyone ballpark something.


Pat

Just finished talking to Dave Sutherland's Mom.  He doesn't want to talk to anyone at all, but she agreed to relay a message to him.  I wished him well, but I don't think it will matter much.  She says he is staying by himself, is sick, and is not going to get better.  My guess is Type II diabetes, and that's probably only the start.  

He still has the art for the original DMG and "A Paladin in Hell", as far as I know.

Cent

Hope DCS gets better, though I think we all realize that the time is coming when some of the old pioneers of D&D may be leaving us in the not-so-distant future.  

If you do speak to him wish him well from his fans and I agree with you, I worked with some of the classic animators and have some cool pieces from them and it breaks me up when I hear one is ill or has passed, I hope they (like DCS) realize how much joy they brought us.

This is all very cool!!

I watched Dave from the day he attended the "gala" re-opening of Fantasy Realm at its second location, to the day he drove away in his overstuffed car.  I rarely saw him smile.  He told me about a little of the 22 years at TSR, how he'd been in various positions of authority, but had ultimately turned away from them to pursue his craft.  Kinda reminds me of myself, in the Navy.  And just like the Navy, he eventually ended up working for "leaders" who focused on very little other than getting to a position of authority and abusing it for the gratification of their egos.  

Not to say they were the only ones in charge there.  But I guess Gary Gygax' family had some real issues, and that made it easier for the "empire builders" to play the political games and esconce themselves in places where they made darn sure nothing could be done without their say-so.

And so it came about one day, that TSR couldn't pay the bills and the distibutors became leery of the company's spending money on stupid, half-baked projects that flattered one empire-builder or another, but made no money at all (ask me about the Spelljammer commercials, done in stop-motion animation).  Then WOTC swooped in with an offer; trim your fat and we'll give you X dollars.  By this time, the empire builders were the primary decision-makers, and stood to profit most by a sale, so they fired employees like crazy.  And then, with little left but the creative team for 3rd Ed. and the vast intellectual property rights, they handed it over to WOTC for a handsome sum.

Of course, Dave felt betrayed by all this.  Never mind that he'd made his bed over the years by refusing to learn effective ways of dealing with the politicians.  What did he expect?  Of course, this realization might have been a good part of his depression.  They did the predictable - they used him, then used him up, then fired him.  All those years of putting himself into his work came back to bite him, in the form of the American tradition for "job=value as a person"; he was suddenly worthless.  

He had no way of protesting - 22 years of service?  All the things he'd accomplished?  Who would he go to, to protest?  That stuff meant nothing to his bosses.  They thought he was a fool, and made no secret of their lack of respect.  After all, if he *wasn't* a fool, he'd be in charge, right?  You're all familiar with the Dilbert strip?  Well, the pointy-haired boss is not made up.  He really exists - a wealthy, self-satisfied combination of PhD, ego and wanton stupidity.  And far from being an object of derision - as he is in the strip - there are legions of ambitious people who will do anything to be just like the pointy-haired boss.  

And Dave worked for these kinds of people.  They are like floating turds - they always seem to be around, and they always rise to the top.  Of course, he had problems at home.  His wife was sorta warped by childhood molestation, from what I gathered.  And when he was fired, she promptly divorced him and took the kids.  He still had to support them, though.  So he had to get a job.  So he put on his "game face" and presented his resume to WOTC.  

Six months passed and no word.  It wasn't that they said 'no', it was that they didn't say anything at all.  As the time passed, he became more and more reclusive (although he entertained me and John when we came over) and more depressed.  There finally came a day when he wouldn't anwer the door, and when the manager finally opened it, Dave was there, looking like hell, with beer cans everywhere.  Well, he moved to another apartment and I got him a computer for working with, but he'd already decided to move on.  He gave us his bookcase, with most of the books, as well as some artwork, miniatures, and his entire collection of TSR materials he'd worked on from over the years.  I even got his drafting table.  Then he drove off for Nebraska.

I sold the collection, less a few pieces, for about half its listed value (about $600) and he split the money with me.   I have some of the artwork I commisioned from him over that summer, but Dave is gone from gaming forever.  He was betrayed - by others and by himself - and I can't blame him for never wanting to look back.  I don't give much thought to the Navy these days, even after 22 years, and I got out last August!

Yeah, this is the story Dave told me, and maybe it ain't the whole truth.  Or maybe it's just the truth from his point of view.  Only a masochist paints himself as a complete failure without wincing and trying to hide *some* blame.  Let's just say "Lord love him and grant him peace", and let it go at that.  And maybe look at where *we* are, and see if the same thing isn't happening to us.  People don't change.  There's a lesson here.

Cent