Guidon Games' Tractics by Reese & Tucker with Gygax
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Post Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 8:22 pm 
 

I also collect wargames and on eBay, about a year and 1/2 ago, I picked up a sweet copy of Guidon's "Tractics" for under $50. It's by Mike Reese and Leon Tucker with Gary Gygax. Illustrations are by Don Lowry. Copyright is 1971. Also in the box is a copy of "Fast Rules" also by Reese and Tucker, 2nd print, copyright Jan '72. All books and charts are in like new condition, tight with no wear. The box is in great shape with only minor shelf wear.
I know this is a D&D site, but I have seen people ask about other items and it is connected to TSR. I don't know of any site like The Acaeum for wargames. If someone knows of one, PLEASE let me know. Does anyone know an ballpark value for this? It's one of my favorite pieces in my collection, so I'm not looking to sell, but I am interested to know what it might be worth. I certainly think I got a good deal on it. Thanks!
             Tom


Started playing D&D at Great Lakes in '76-'77. Went to Dungeon in Lake Geneva. Got to adventure in original Blackmoor. Saved some rare pieces from then, not in best shape: Palace of Vampire Queen, Beastmaker Mountain. Started collecting recently.

  

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Post Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 9:00 pm 
 

There were many printing of this.  The earliest version featured a woodgrain box (the same type of box later used for D&D), with all three booklets stating "Guidon Games".  Later versions started swapping out the various booklets for those that stated "TSR Games", and the last iteration was a white box with all three booklets stating "TSR Games".

The earliest versions do sell for a decent amount on eBay.  If you have a first print set (everything says "Guidon Games") in good condition, it could fetch $150 - $200.  Your mileage may vary.

Foul

  


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Post Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 9:14 pm 
 

Foul,
The box has a wide black border with Guidon Games on it. Inside the black border it's a light tan in color, but I don't know if you'd call it woodgrain. Since I've never seen a woodgrain D&D box in person, so I suppose it could be. All books are Guidon and there is no print info, just the 1971 copyright execpt for the "Fast Rules" booklet which is also Guidon but says 2nd printing '72 on the inside. It's got to be the real deal. I've seen ones on eBay with the mixed Guidon and TSR books and this is definitely not one of those.
Are you also a wargame collector, Foul?
     Tom


Started playing D&D at Great Lakes in '76-'77. Went to Dungeon in Lake Geneva. Got to adventure in original Blackmoor. Saved some rare pieces from then, not in best shape: Palace of Vampire Queen, Beastmaker Mountain. Started collecting recently.

  

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Post Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 9:19 pm 
 

Sounds like a first print.  Though the copies I've seen definitely have a dark woodgrain-colored box -- it's been a while, so I might be mistaken.  The three Guidon books are a giveaway, though.

I'm not a wargame collector, but I have kept a tab on the Guidon products due to their connection with D&D.  I've noticed there's a number of other people who do as well -- Guidon products, while not particularly interesting to most pure-wargame collectors, often fetch some of the highest wargame prices, probably due to D&D-crossover folks like me.

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Post Posted: Tue May 03, 2005 11:15 pm 
 

The Woodgrain set was first published by TSR. Guidon Games originally published it and it came in a black box. The Guidon version is much harder to find and will probably sell for more than the TSR version. Just look what the Guidon Fight in the Skies recently went for. Foolfoot is right about the printing order of the TSR versions.

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 12:47 am 
 

Ya, Burntwire is right. The Guidon 1st is in a black box…we have one. We collect the old wargames as well, I personally love to read the old rules... takes me back to a simpler time predating video games. It's was us who picked up both the Fight in the Skies, and the Alexander the Great. It's hard enough to find these games complete let alone in the shrink, these are the only ones I've or any fellow wargaming collectors I know have ever seen. There worth a fortune to the collectors of these games, and many don't lurk on ebay. I'm total surprised we won both though. After reciving them, I just mentioned it to the owner of the local store that has an older wargamer scene and the offers were a flying!

Alot of Warhammer folks colect the older wargames as well. Sorta their roots.


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 1:41 am 
 

Likewise, I don't know what the attraction to Guidon products is but they consistently sell for many times more than comparable products from other companies in the same era. I guess the Gygax connection, the fact that they were top quality products, and that there were a limited number of products (with few remaining in existance) make it rather popular.

The last Guidon Tractics set I saw on ebay (a few months ago now) went for $71 - this set was in good condition with some marks and scuffing. And the last (and only) Fast Play rules I've seen was the copy Burnt sold a while back, which went for $30 maybe?

I have 2 TSR Tractics sets, one woodgrain, one white box, and a Guidon Alexander the Great. And I have a copy of Alexander's Other Battles, a supplement to the Guidon game put out by Panzerfaust Publications (run by Don Lowry).

Bottom line, to get a Guidon Tractics and Fast Play rules for under $50 is a bargain.

Regards

Mike

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 6:28 am 
 

Howdy Tom,


Here is a first print I purchased a short while back:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... eName=WDVW

The box is black. Not until TSR's first print (1975) did they switch to a verticle woodgrain box.


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 3:39 pm 
 

invincibleoverlord wrote:It's was us who picked up both the Fight in the Skies, and the Alexander the Great. It's hard enough to find these games complete let alone in the shrink, these are the only ones I've or any fellow wargaming collectors I know have ever seen. There worth a fortune to the collectors of these games, and many don't lurk on ebay. I'm total surprised we won both though. After reciving them, I just mentioned it to the owner of the local store that has an older wargamer scene and the offers were a flying!

*g*. Hey, I could've bid you up a few hundred dollars on Alexander the Great if you'd really wanted, Mike. ;)
Would've expected that to have been the pricier of the two if other ppl from around here had joined in.

Anyhow; seemed best to advertise both to the list, so that no-one could've complained they didn't know... then just stand well back and keep pretending I don't collect shrinkwrap!

Certainly not seen either in shrink before and probably not again for a l-o-n-g time... :D

invincibleoverlord wrote:Alot of Warhammer folks colect the older wargames as well. Sorta their roots.

aside: In theory the most significant item in the wargaming "roots" of Warhammer is the yellow book at the top right of the first pic here;
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 5184434142

(Not a lot of 'em folks seem to know that, though).

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 3:48 pm 
 

stormber wrote:Howdy Tom,


Here is a first print I purchased a short while back:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... eName=WDVW

The box is black. Not until TSR's first print (1975) did they switch to a verticle woodgrain box.


Futures Bright,

Paul


Do the booklets in TSR's first print have ISBNs?

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 4:03 pm 
 

burntwire wrote:The Woodgrain set was first published by TSR. Guidon Games originally published it and it came in a black box. The Guidon version is much harder to find and will probably sell for more than the TSR version.

*g*. Depends on whether I push the next auction or not, I s'pose.

Personally I'd rate either the Guidon black box or TSR woodgrain at around $120-140 in very fine condition. Possibly $20 or so higher for the Guidon edition.
That latest woodgrain copy on eBay was mislabelled as "Tactics" which probably hurt the price... Both editions have definite "selling points".

Have seen one woodgrain copy to three black most recently, but I don't keep that good tabs on the auctions, so that might not be a true reflection of scarcity.
The Guidon set was also on sale for longer, anyhow.

(side note for onlookers: average condition for Tractics sets is a lot better than "average" for early D&D sets. JMO, of course!).

burntwire wrote:Just look what the Guidon Fight in the Skies recently went for.

Mint in shrink is kinda unusual... 8O
Have seen various other Guidon items go through at around the $40-50 mark and the last Guidon Alexander the Great wasn't vastly more than that, IIRC (albeit certainly not museum quality in shrinkwrap).

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 4:12 pm 
 

mdr003 wrote:And the last (and only) Fast Play rules I've seen was the copy Burnt sold a while back, which went for $30 maybe?

Burnie Bros. paid $27.77 and I undercut that by a couple of dollars, I think. Can't find the snipe record for some reason...
However, that was also a second print (1/72) rather than the first (5/70).
(The first pre-dates Tractics although it might not have been released by Guidon, given their stock numbering sequence(??)).

=

Oh, and Noble Knight still have that copy of Ironclad (Tom Wham & Don Lowry) for $18, if anyone's interested...
Noble Knight Games Board and Wargames - Board & War Games (Guidon Games)


....

Would go with $175 or thereabouts, Tom, fyi. (+50-100% for insurance purposes). :P

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 5:27 pm 
 

p.s. Ah, I forgot to add this compilation of prices from eBay in 2000, "for comparison";
(Nothing from Guidon on that list, anyhow... "War in the Pacific" was always a big 'un; and not just in price. :)
Dunno how often it reaches those heights nowadays; viz. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 5188191555 )

=
If there are any updates to those price check lists over on ConsimWorld Forum , I can't find them off-hand. :(

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 6:52 pm 
 

My Tractics looks exactly like Stormber's. I thought the woodgrain set was probably not untill TSR.
    I know this is a D&D site but you wargamers take a look at eBay item number 5188890395 that I won a couple of Sundays ago. It should be here any day.
    Now before you say "So what", read the entire description and pay particular attention to the list of what's included. Tell me that's not the deal of the century.
    I also have an unpunched "La Bataille de la Moskowa" from Martial Enterprises. That one set me back a few pesos.
    In a crossover I have an unpunched White Bear/Red Moon(2nd) that I got at the same time from the same seller. I still think those are the most beautiful counters ever produced.
                                                      Tom


Started playing D&D at Great Lakes in '76-'77. Went to Dungeon in Lake Geneva. Got to adventure in original Blackmoor. Saved some rare pieces from then, not in best shape: Palace of Vampire Queen, Beastmaker Mountain. Started collecting recently.

  

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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 7:33 pm 
 

stormber wrote:Howdy Tom,


Here is a first print I purchased a short while back:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... eName=WDVW

The box is black. Not until TSR's first print (1975) did they switch to a verticle woodgrain box.


Futures Bright,

Paul


Ahh... my mistake. For some reason I recalled the $71 underbid, not the final price. Funny how memory works sometimes. When I checked the auction I also remembered I bid on that set, but my snipe was swallowed up somewhere between $71 and Harami's bid.... I think I tried $111 or thereabouts.

And I agree with Tom, the WB&RM counters are some of the best counter artwork I've ever seen.

Regards

Mike

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 8:38 pm 
 

mdr003 wrote:Ahh... my mistake. For some reason I recalled the $71 underbid, not the final price. Funny how memory works sometimes. When I checked the auction I also remembered I bid on that set, but my snipe was swallowed up somewhere between $71 and Harami's bid.... I think I tried $111 or thereabouts.


Ah, I'd thought you were around about the $90-100 mark, Mike.
*makes note for reference* (sry! ;))

mdr003 wrote:And I agree with Tom, the WB&RM counters are some of the best counter artwork I've ever seen.

*nods in agreement with y'both*

Like I could resist posting those scans on <DanZ>'s thread when his first edition came up for sale...
(Oh, same day you joined, Tom. Coincidence?).
White Bear & Red Moon • Collecting Appraisal •  The Acaeum


==
*is still puzzling over that Blitzkrieg*

The Module System booklet is rare, no? But I only see the booklet on the auction listing...
I remember reading that on one of the GenCon auction pages; noted a few times on Gencon

Am I missing more, Tom?

  


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 9:16 pm 
 

The description includes Minor Country and Red and Blue sheets along with Weather Charts etc. I believe someone might have taken their S&T #19 and stuck it in the Blitzkrieg box without bothering to mount and cut the sheets. Those early sub games did not come with die-cut counters. I'll know more when I see it, because I've never seen one in person. I'm quite anxious, because I'm down to 5 that I need to complete an unpunched/uncut run from #18 to #90(the SPI years).
  I know you will all think I'm nuts, but I told the seller, that depending on the condition, I will send her some additional funds. She had no clue what she had and it never hurts to be on the good side of a seller like that. Besides, she might be single.
  To give you an idea of the possible value, there is a MOUNTED and CUT(also came with unmounted sheets) S&T #21 Flight of the Goebben / Chicago,Chicago listed on eBay right now. With 1 day to go it's at ~$214. That's right $214.00. SNAP BITCHES!!!!
                        Tom
p.s. and after this I'll try to stay away from the wargame stuff. There is a website called Hexwar that, in conjunction with Decision Games, is putting some of these wargames up to play by email. You can play Napoleon at Waterloo for free. If you want to play any others you have to subscribe, but then your play is limitless. For someone who NEVER had anyone to play against(small town and I mean the cows outnumber the people at least 10-1), this is a godsend. I now have opponents all over the world. There is also a FOW feature with the WWII games(Westwall, Island War, and North Africa Quads) that I absolutely adore. I subscribe by the year and if you do subscribe make sure you put down my name(tntwargo) as having recommended Hexwar to you. I get 2 extra weeks for each one(shameless, eh?). If you just want to play me a game of NAW let me know, because non-subscribers can't challenge subscribers.


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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 10:56 pm 
 

Howdy,


afoolandhis$ wrote:Do the booklets in TSR's first print have ISBNs?


I don't see an ISBN on the Guidon black box set, TSR 1st print woodgrain, or TSR 2nd print woodgrain. Is it on the TSR 3rd print white box set somewhere?


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Post Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 7:57 pm 
 

This is an old thread, but bumped it as I have a question. I am contemplating bidding on Mike's Woodgrain Tractics, which he put in the classifieds here:


** expired eBay auction **


But I honestly have no idea what these are worth. Does anyone have any idea / suggestions?

  

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Post Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:27 pm 
 

They are practically worthless - starting bid is way overpriced - move along :)  

There was a recent auction for one in excellent shape that ended at around $220:


** expired eBay auction **


Right now, Mike's copy is going cheap.

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