Living greyhawk Journals
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Post Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:02 pm 
 

What are they and what are they valued at?

I do not even know what they look like, but I have seen them up for auction more than once with no pictures, only stated in the listings as in my title above.

Below is a current listing of them (With other Greyhawk Modules, etc...) that will soon end (ten hours hence at the time of this post)

cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIte ... RK:MEBI:IT

I was unable to search them up on the Acaeum's search engine. Most likely I am just doing it wrong... :roll:


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Post Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:11 pm 
 

They were published for a while from 1999 onwards by Piazo (Dungeon Magazine/Dragon Magazine). They didn't really take off buy I suppose if you're into 2E Greyhawk they are a great suppliment to the official TSR stuff. I don't imagine they bear much resemblance to EGG's Greyhawk, following TSRs post-EGG line.


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Post Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:01 pm 
 

These magazines covered the Living Greyhawk campaign. Chief writer was Erik Mona (who's posted on this forum before) and Sean Reynolds was regular contributor, too. There are six of them, from number zero to five. Issues six to twenty were printed as articles inside DRAGON magazine (issues 290 to 306) and today they appear inside DUNGEON magazine.


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Post Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:37 pm 
 

When issues #1-#5 were released and mailed to members of the RPGA network, it was almost a license to print money. You could subscribe to the RPGA for a year for $20 or so, and turn around and sell each issue LGJ issue for $20-$60 each on ebay..

I sold one of my issues for $55, turned around and used that money to resubscribe to RPGA for three years when they had a special offer for $50. Soon after Polyhedron(the mag released for RPGA for years) was subsumed into Dungeon magazine, and I got a 3 years subscription to Dungeon instead.

Ah the glory days of RPG frenzy on ebay...

  


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Post Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:46 pm 
 

dave wrote:When issues #1-#5 were released and mailed to members of the RPGA network, it was almost a license to print money. You could subscribe to the RPGA for a year for $20 or so, and turn around and sell each issue LGJ issue for $20-$60 each on ebay...


8O

Glad to see prices have dropped dramatically since then :lol:


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Post Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 5:09 pm 
 

I forget if it was in Polyhedron or in LGJ back then, but if you look in those issues, around the time LGJ #3 and #4 were released, there is a small blurb by Erik's team basically saying, "What the hell are people thinking? Just subscribe."

You could only get those prices right after it came out, a lot of Greyhawk fans weren't members and didn't know they were coming out, so it caused a mad rush for awhile. Now with more entering circulation the prices have stabilised.

You can still see this with those RPGA only modules that come out, like the Green Regent series. The Jan and Feb '05 modules sell for $30+ right now, while the modules released six months ago or a year ago are about $5.

  

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Post Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2005 11:32 pm 
 

dave wrote:I forget if it was in Polyhedron or in LGJ back then, but if you look in those issues, around the time LGJ #3 and #4 were released, there is a small blurb by Erik's team basically saying, "What the hell are people thinking? Just subscribe."

You could only get those prices right after it came out, a lot of Greyhawk fans weren't members and didn't know they were coming out, so it caused a mad rush for awhile. Now with more entering circulation the prices have stabilised.

You can still see this with those RPGA only modules that come out, like the Green Regent series. The Jan and Feb '05 modules sell for $30+ right now, while the modules released six months ago or a year ago are about $5.


Not only that, but you could order the Living Greyhawk Journals for quite awhile directly for $5 apiece, it wasn't like it was a well kept secret.  I remember buying 10 copies each of #1-#3, then reselling them for $10-$20 each on Ebay at the time.  Kind of like when someone pays twice as much as a 25th Anniversary edition costs just to get a L3 Deep Dwarven Delve....

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Post Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:07 am 
 

The Journels are actually for 3rd ed and not 2nd ed.  Great material if you played in living greyhawk and far from rare.


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 2:04 am 
 

It depends upon what you mean by rare. I don't recall exact numbers, but I would guess we printed fewer than 8,000 of each issue other than #0, which was packed in Dragon and given away at Gen Con. I think we printed 75,000 of that one, but most would have been destroyed with unsold magazines.

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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 10:12 am 
 

Erik Mona wrote:It depends upon what you mean by rare. I don't recall exact numbers, but I would guess we printed fewer than 8,000 of each issue other than #0, which was packed in Dragon and given away at Gen Con. I think we printed 75,000 of that one, but most would have been destroyed with unsold magazines.

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I would cosider Rare less than 100 copies


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 10:27 am 
 

Blackmoor wrote:I would cosider Rare less than 100 copies


so its doubtful that 99.999999% of RPG stuff isnt rare then, as i would imagine that there are more than 100 copies of the majority of products out there somewhere?



  

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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:38 am 
 

Blackmoor wrote:
Erik Mona wrote:It depends upon what you mean by rare. I don't recall exact numbers, but I would guess we printed fewer than 8,000 of each issue other than #0, which was packed in Dragon and given away at Gen Con. I think we printed 75,000 of that one, but most would have been destroyed with unsold magazines.

--Erik Mona


I would cosider Rare less than 100 copies


I guess limited edition Tamoachans and Ghost Towers aren't rare then since there are 300 of them out there somewhere.   :wink:

  

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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:57 am 
 

I would guess that Blackmoor meant surviving copies.

  


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:59 am 
 

dathon wrote:
Blackmoor wrote:
I would cosider Rare less than 100 copies


I guess limited edition Tamoachans and Ghost Towers aren't rare then since there are 300 of them out there somewhere.  :wink:

While I disagree with blackmoor's assessment of "rare", don't make the mistake of assuming there are 300 Tamos or Ghost Towers out there...about 300 were printed, and I very much doubt the survival rate is anywhere near 100%.

Only 30 Tamos and 25 Ghost Towers are currently accounted for on this site, and it's likely there are a few more.  Even if you triple those numbers they still fall into blackmoor's "rare" category.   :wink:

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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:05 pm 
 

Wow, that's some reaction, rare is a term used far to frequently in this forum and abusivily on Ebay.  Rare should be considered well rare!  Less than 100 copies?  Why not?  I imagine that there are less than 100 copies of both Tomochan and Ghost towers out there and that would indeed make them rare.

You are right though, 99% of items are not rare and that is the way it should be.  Just because something is desirable or hard to find does not make it rare.  Is H4 rare?  not, how about Kobald Hall? I do not think so.  What is rare out there?  How about the 1st print woodgrain boxset, pre-pub R series, manuscripts, Tomoachan, ghost towers and probably a few others.


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:07 pm 
 

Rare is less than 100 copies? That is WAY too low. If you apply a 30% survival rate to a product, then Tamoachan/Inverness etc barely make the list. And they are VERY rare.
However, there are several Tamos and Invernesses that I know of not on the Acaeum list.


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:08 pm 
 

Rare is a relative term, usually compared to a typical production printing. When the printing of an item is limited it could be considered "rare" as compared to a standard printing of an item.

To those interested:

Rarity is essentially based upon two factors:

1. The limited quantity of the item.
2. The number remaining of the item, at the different grades.

Based on these two factors, one can see why, in general, the older an item is, the more "rare" it becomes.

That being said, rarity is just one of four criteria that are typically used to determine the value of an item. I've ranked these, from my perspective, in the order of importance, as far as D&D-type collectibles are concerned. With other types of collectibles these can vary in importance.

1. Popularity - Name recognition, company, creator, gaming system, market presence.
2. Rarity - Quantity produced, number remaining per grade.
3. Grade - Condition of the item.
4. Quality - Art, content, condition, packaging, creator.

  

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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:14 pm 
 

dbartman wrote:Rare is a relative term, usually compared to a typical production printing. When the printing of an item is limited it could be considered "rare" as compared to a standard printing of an item.

To those interested:

Rarity is essentially based upon two factors:

1. The limited quantity of the item.
2. The number remaining of the item, at the different grades.

Based on these two factors, one can see why, in general, the older an item is, the more "rare" it becomes.

That being said, rarity is just one of four criteria that are typically used to determine the value of an item. I've ranked these, from my perspective, in the order of importance, as far as D&D-type collectibles are concerned. With other types of collectibles these can vary in importance.

1. Popularity - Name recognition, company, creator, gaming system, market presence.
2. Rarity - Quantity produced, number remaining per grade.
3. Grade - Condition of the item.
4. Quality - Art, content, condition, packaging, creator.


Well said, on another note where this started, none of the greyhawk living journals should be considered rare, they are at best simply hard to find.


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:41 pm 
 

Rare is most certainly a very relative word, but didn't 1st print woodies have a print run of 1000? With that being the case, I think everybody agrees that they are in fact rare. One other factor involved in rarity, is retention. Some items are perceived to be less rare because they seem to pop up much more frequetly. That is because of of the retention factor of the owners. Retention can be attributed to a several factors, mostly though as stated above by dbartman, as well as one other: popularity of the item, quality of the item, and also the perceived value of the item. Items that fall into those categories will appear much less frequently than others, because of the fact that owners are more prone to hold on to those items because of those factors. To give an example, look at Wild Things and Dark and Hidden Ways versus the R and RPGA mods. They are both listed as 4s for rarity value, and even factoring in the wariness of folks leery of buying them due to the easiness of forging them with WT/D&HW, which appear less frequently and always command higher prices? The R & RPGA modules without fail. Just my .02.


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 3:19 pm 
 

As for the Tamoachans and Ghost Towers I would estimate that most of the 300 are still surviving because of the "collector's edition" note on them, plus they are enumerated out of 300 (which is pretty tiny compared to many items labeled collectable out of 50,000 like Star Trek boardgames and such).  While many things that say "collector's edition" on them turn out not to be collectable at all, most of the non-collecting savvy public will buy into the label.  Hence, the label on Tamoachan and Ghost Tower would probably save most of them from someone's trash can along the way, while ST1s, which have no special notice on them, are more likely to end up in the trash during a house cleaning or move.

  
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