Grading System Question
Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 1
Author

User avatar

Active Collector

Posts: 97
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
Last Visit: Jul 18, 2021

Post Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 9:16 am 
 

I see the term "Excellent" used a lot, even with collectors when talking about collectible grade, yet the Acaeum grading system makes no mention of this or where this would fall. Is this just a loose term for "Fine"? Or am I overthinking this and i reality its all so subjective it doesn't really matter.

--Thor

  


Verbose Collector

Posts: 1701
Joined: Feb 12, 2005
Last Visit: Jul 26, 2021

Post Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:27 pm 
 

In a better world the Acaeum would have used a grading system that went:
1) Poor
2) Fair
3) Good
4) Very Good
5) Excellent
6) Near Mint
7) Mint

That way, throwing out the two extremes, there would be a 1-5 scale (Fair to Near Mint) and one could start at very Good and move up or down depending. Instead, throwing out the two extremes, we have a 1-6 scale, with the mid point being between Fine and Very fine. I believe it makes grading more difficult, and leads to grade inflation.

To answer your question Thor, excellent is a stand in for Fine and Very Fine.


Shrink is not a condition

  

User avatar

Verbose Collector

Posts: 1594
Joined: Mar 08, 2008
Last Visit: Jul 25, 2021
Location: Toronto, Canada

Post Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:46 pm 
 

I once presented a 'fine' rpg book to a book collector. I did it do that a second time

Since our scale uses the same words with different meanings as other collectible scales, I'd be all for a numbering system, or any other arbitrary scale that improves understanding and expectations

When I sell, I use vague adjectives when they could be construed as grades (eg nice) and specific info when describing defects (pencil,highlighter etc).


I draw the line at collecting... D&D Towels.

Did we need: Jade Magi Sewer Crawl

Shoulda been: ".. from Pangreenia to Floratopolis, from mystical Treeonia of spectral Forests to Schruborial dimensions."  - The Forests of Leng

  

User avatar

Site Admin

Posts: 2104
Joined: Oct 19, 2002
Last Visit: Jul 26, 2021
Location: Honolulu, HI

Post Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:54 pm 
 

We actually do use the same condition scale as comic books:   Overstreet Grading scale How to for comic books | eBay .  

Foul

  

User avatar

Active Collector

Posts: 97
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
Last Visit: Jul 18, 2021

Post Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:41 pm 
 

stratochamp wrote in Grading System Question:In a better world the Acaeum would have used a grading system that went:
1) Poor
2) Fair
3) Good
4) Very Good
5) Excellent
6) Near Mint
7) Mint

That way, throwing out the two extremes, there would be a 1-5 scale (Fair to Near Mint) and one could start at very Good and move up or down depending. Instead, throwing out the two extremes, we have a 1-6 scale, with the mid point being between Fine and Very fine. I believe it makes grading more difficult, and leads to grade inflation.

To answer your question Thor, excellent is a stand in for Fine and Very Fine.



Okay thanks for this!

--Thor

  

User avatar

Active Collector

Posts: 97
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
Last Visit: Jul 18, 2021

Post Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:42 pm 
 

FoulFoot wrote in Grading System Question:We actually do use the same condition scale as comic books:  http://www.ebay.com/gds/Overstreet-Grading-scale-How-to-for-comic-books-/10000000005696333/g.html .  

Foul



This link doesnt work for me, does it work for you guys?

--Thor

  

User avatar

Site Admin

Posts: 2104
Joined: Oct 19, 2002
Last Visit: Jul 26, 2021
Location: Honolulu, HI

Post Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 4:58 pm 
 

Whoops, my code mangled it.  Here's a different version:

Metropolis Comics and Collectibles -  The Online Comic Shop to Buy, Sell, Price & Appraise Comic Books

Foul

  

User avatar

Active Collector

Posts: 97
Joined: Jun 16, 2015
Last Visit: Jul 18, 2021

Post Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 5:58 pm 
 




Ty Sir!

  

User avatar

Prolific Collector

Posts: 634
Joined: Apr 01, 2017
Last Visit: Jul 23, 2021
Location: Missouri

Post Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:35 am 
 

Would anyone care to discuss this further?

I have a few issues with using Overstreet for RPG items. Particularly Box Sets or Modules with the map or the character sheet missing.

Should every box set be graded by the condition of the box? I just picked up a 4th print OD&D Box Set with a ragged box and NM Books, as a set would it be considered Fair? Or somewhere in between?

  


Sage Collector
JG Valuation Board

Posts: 2748
Joined: Feb 10, 2003
Last Visit: Jul 26, 2021
Location: Olde London Towne

Post Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:42 am 
 

For items with significant parts I would tend to grade the bits separately. Something like: "Box Fair (or Good etc..), Booklets VF (or NM)" ... I would not go too far in splitting things up unless it is a particularly significant or valuable item. There is little point separately grading the handouts for a cheap module, but there is value in splitting the grade in your example.

In general it is less about agreeing a single descriptor for your item and more about providing useful (for you and others) information. Hope helpful :)


Let's go fly a kite
Up to the highest height!

  

User avatar

Prolific Collector

Posts: 634
Joined: Apr 01, 2017
Last Visit: Jul 23, 2021
Location: Missouri

Post Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 10:33 pm 
 

red_bus wrote in Grading System Question:For items with significant parts I would tend to grade the bits separately. Something like: "Box Fair (or Good etc..), Booklets VF (or NM)" ... I would not go too far in splitting things up unless it is a particularly significant or valuable item. There is little point separately grading the handouts for a cheap module, but there is value in splitting the grade in your example.

In general it is less about agreeing a single descriptor for your item and more about providing useful (for you and others) information. Hope helpful :)


If I was selling something, that would be fine. I'm wondering more about comparison grading. I'm semi-involved with a good example of it right now.

My 4th print box set with a ragged box and NM books, another 4th print with a better box approximately Fine+ books condition-wise but they all have pen writing in them sold a few weeks ago. Another 4th print is going to be available later this week - decent box but not perfect, no splits and the books are NM but they are all initialed in pen inside the covers. I'd say value-wise, these are all similar. But I didn't want writing in my books so the one I have would be my choice of the 3. Someone else may care less about book condition or writing and want the best box.

Someone can say they are all approximately the same grade but a procedure should be in place to get there.

I had to come up with a value a few weeks ago on what would an early printing of Men & Magic be worth. Is that a third of the same print Box Set or a fourth. What if that M&M is a first print. I would think a Woodgrain Box minus the content would be worth a significant percentage more of the amount of it's whole set value than any White Box in relation to it's complete set value.

I hope this doesn't sound like I'm trying to count angels on the head of a pin. But besides the box sets, just on a regular book or module, Overstreet is a decent enough guideline but shouldn't point values for defects be significantly different. Just because gaming material is treated differently than comics. Or maybe it shouldn't be.

One of my biggest concerns is - what is the significance of writing in comparison to value. How much writing is how much defect point value.

I appreciate your taking the time to answer red_bus but I'm looking to be able to compare items to values given here or to higher or lower grade sold items. I think it would be very helpful in the long run, and seriously this is the group that could be gaming's version of Overstreet or what Scott is for Postage Stamps. No one has broken down what condition means in regards to value yet.

Edit - From rereading the Grading page from the Front Desk, I think it does answer my "writing" question. I guess the short of it is that many things come down to opinion. I'm going to find some info I have and submit here and see what you all think. I'm not sure where I put it so it might take a while.

  

User avatar

Verbose Collector
JG Valuation Board
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 1614
Joined: Aug 19, 2008
Last Visit: Jul 13, 2021
Location: Chicago, IL

Post Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:09 pm 
 

Mister Yuk wrote in Grading System Question:
red_bus wrote in Grading System Question:For items with significant parts I would tend to grade the bits separately. Something like: "Box Fair (or Good etc..), Booklets VF (or NM)" ... I would not go too far in splitting things up unless it is a particularly significant or valuable item. There is little point separately grading the handouts for a cheap module, but there is value in splitting the grade in your example.

In general it is less about agreeing a single descriptor for your item and more about providing useful (for you and others) information. Hope helpful :)


If I was selling something, that would be fine. I'm wondering more about comparison grading. I'm semi-involved with a good example of it right now.

My 4th print box set with a ragged box and NM books, another 4th print with a better box approximately Fine+ books condition-wise but they all have pen writing in them sold a few weeks ago. Another 4th print is going to be available later this week - decent box but not perfect, no splits and the books are NM but they are all initialed in pen inside the covers. I'd say value-wise, these are all similar. But I didn't want writing in my books so the one I have would be my choice of the 3. Someone else may care less about book condition or writing and want the best box.

Someone can say they are all approximately the same grade but a procedure should be in place to get there.


I would buy the first two boxed sets and Frankenstein a super-set, and ask $500 for it... :wink:


Mister Yuk wrote in Grading System Question:
I had to come up with a value a few weeks ago on what would an early printing of Men & Magic be worth. Is that a third of the same print Box Set or a fourth. What if that M&M is a first print. I would think a Woodgrain Box minus the content would be worth a significant percentage more of the amount of it's whole set value than any White Box in relation to it's complete set value.


The white box books (in a set) seem to sell for around $100. Individual books (usually) sell for a third of that. Maybe the 4th print books a little more (Hobbits vs. Halflings and such...)?

Woodgrain everything is a crap shoot... books and boxes.... If you're lucky you can find a box for $100. The books that sold for [What was that ~$400?] might have been a reasonable purchase for the guy that has a box and no books...


Mister Yuk wrote in Grading System Question:I hope this doesn't sound like I'm trying to count angels on the head of a pin. But besides the box sets, just on a regular book or module, Overstreet is a decent enough guideline but shouldn't point values for defects be significantly different. Just because gaming material is treated differently than comics. Or maybe it shouldn't be.

One of my biggest concerns is - what is the significance of writing in comparison to value. How much writing is how much defect point value.


Of course the answer is... Depends on the writing  :roll:

Is it the initials of someone in the 3 books? Did they underline certain key words? Did they write their doctoral thesis (in the book) about why the 1st Edition AD&D PHB sucked? Was Gary Gygax's Autograph in a DMG written to someone named Andrew? (Yeah I got that one cheap... AWESOME!!!). I don't believe there ever be a formula per se. Red Bus is right... Just keep the buyer(s) informed of what is in the books in the first place.

Mister Yuk wrote in Grading System Question:I appreciate your taking the time to answer red_bus but I'm looking to be able to compare items to values given here or to higher or lower grade sold items. I think it would be very helpful in the long run, and seriously this is the group that could be gaming's version of Overstreet or what Scott is for Postage Stamps. No one has broken down what condition means in regards to value yet.

Edit - From rereading the Grading page from the Front Desk, I think it does answer my "writing" question. I guess the short of it is that many things come down to opinion. I'm going to find some info I have and submit here and see what you all think. I'm not sure where I put it so it might take a while.


RPG’s, D&D in particular has had a major influence in my life. It’s bonded me together with life long friends...it’s that bond in life not just as friends, but in our jokes, our mannerisms, and what we find funny. Invincible Overlord

 ICQ  

User avatar

Prolific Collector

Posts: 634
Joined: Apr 01, 2017
Last Visit: Jul 23, 2021
Location: Missouri

Post Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:11 pm 
 

Invincible Overlord wrote in Grading System Question:
I would buy the first two boxed sets and Frankenstein a super-set, and ask $500 for it... :wink:


That's about what I was thinking. I'm definitely considering buying this set coming up and doing that but I'm keeping the super-set.

Invincible Overlord wrote in Grading System Question:
Mister Yuk wrote in Grading System Question:
I had to come up with a value a few weeks ago on what would an early printing of Men & Magic be worth. Is that a third of the same print Box Set or a fourth. What if that M&M is a first print. I would think a Woodgrain Box minus the content would be worth a significant percentage more of the amount of it's whole set value than any White Box in relation to it's complete set value.


The white box books (in a set) seem to sell for around $100. Individual books (usually) sell for a third of that. Maybe the 4th print books a little more (Hobbits vs. Halflings and such...)?

Woodgrain everything is a crap shoot... books and boxes.... If you're lucky you can find a box for $100. The books that sold for [What was that ~$400?] might have been a reasonable purchase for the guy that has a box and no books...


I appreciate your input on this. Yep, those Woodys, well they are extra special and deserving of a good price.


Invincible Overlord wrote in Grading System Question:
Mister Yuk wrote in Grading System Question:I hope this doesn't sound like I'm trying to count angels on the head of a pin. But besides the box sets, just on a regular book or module, Overstreet is a decent enough guideline but shouldn't point values for defects be significantly different. Just because gaming material is treated differently than comics. Or maybe it shouldn't be.

One of my biggest concerns is - what is the significance of writing in comparison to value. How much writing is how much defect point value.


Of course the answer is... Depends on the writing  :roll:

Is it the initials of someone in the 3 books? Did they underline certain key words? Did they write their doctoral thesis (in the book) about why the 1st Edition AD&D PHB sucked? Was Gary Gygax's Autograph in a DMG written to someone named Andrew? (Yeah I got that one cheap... AWESOME!!!). I don't believe there ever be a formula per se. Red Bus is right... Just keep the buyer(s) informed of what is in the books in the first place.


I think my favorite description like that was a 2nd or 3rd print Monster Manual (or maybe it was an early print Deities & Demigods) that had some of the illustrations colored in and done well I'll add, and the seller actually wrote "in pretty nice condition if someone wouldn't have used it as a Coloring Book, oh well" I LMAO so hard!

Yes, that is very cool on the DMG. I sell a lot of books, not gaming though. Some of the dedications and other stuff I find in them are hilarious, especially old school books. My recent cool find though was a big AAA Map Book, like from a gas station. It had this whole whirlwind tour of the US all laid out with itinerary and notes, artistic drawings, and poetry all in French. I'm sitting there wondering - how in the &%$* did this end up with me?

  


Sage Collector

Posts: 2117
Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Last Visit: Jul 25, 2021
Location: Far Harad, Texas

Post Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 2:56 pm 
 

Mister Yuk wrote in Grading System Question:My recent cool find though was a big AAA Map Book, like from a gas station. It had this whole whirlwind tour of the US all laid out with itinerary and notes, artistic drawings, and poetry all in French. I'm sitting there wondering - how in the &%$* did this end up with me?


Damn.. that does sound like a nice find, with a bonus mystery of what happened on the trip. Was it a romance? An international smuggling deal gone horribly wrong? A quest to find a powerful magical relic?

  

User avatar

Prolific Collector

Posts: 634
Joined: Apr 01, 2017
Last Visit: Jul 23, 2021
Location: Missouri

Post Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:41 am 
 

sauromatian wrote in Grading System Question:
Mister Yuk wrote in Grading System Question:My recent cool find though was a big AAA Map Book, like from a gas station. It had this whole whirlwind tour of the US all laid out with itinerary and notes, artistic drawings, and poetry all in French. I'm sitting there wondering - how in the &%$* did this end up with me?


Damn.. that does sound like a nice find, with a bonus mystery of what happened on the trip. Was it a romance? An international smuggling deal gone horribly wrong? A quest to find a powerful magical relic?


It seemed like just vacation and some bored doodling and writing but I do like your imagination :)

  
Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 1