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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2005 4:01 am 
 

MShipley88 wrote:ludikbazar


i have bought stuff off that guy before, he's a real nice friendly guy.... very easy to deal with and fast to ship too...

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Post Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 4:30 pm 
 

Well one more research question (Missed them I'm sure :D )
This one involves item 62: Revised City State of the Invincible Overlord Playing Aid. First the info I have from my own and other places....

1st Printing: (1978) Cover has brown/grayish background with red lettering that comes with a JG item list that lists no releases after Village Book I.

2nd Printing: (1979?) Cover has a gray background with red lettering. ‘Created and Approved for use with Dungeons & Dragons' and ‘Official Judges Guild Fantasy Game Aid' on the cover along with a large ‘$8.00' centered at the bottom of the cover.

3rd Printing: (1980) Cover has gray background with red lettering. ‘Official Playing Aid Approved for Dungeons & Dragons' on the cover. 80 pages and doesn't count cover as page 1. Item number and price in small box at bottom left corner.

4th Printing: (1981) Cover has red background with white lettering. ‘Official Playing Aid Approved for Dungeons & Dragons' on the cover. 96 pages with small item number and price at bottom left corner. 6th edition is stated on the first page.

Now I am wondering more along the lines of the 1st/2nd print (I have a photo of what I've dubbed the 2nd but not to sure it is really the 2nd). First is the information correct as listed? And for those that have any of the 1st or 2nd prints what is the highest number for the Booty List/Treasure Vault? Copyright Date? Pages in the book? What does the cover state regarding price/approved for../etc? (well actually photos/scans would be better :) )

Thanks, and I think that is all for now, oh yeah..SEND PHOTOS OR SCANS! (or sending the item to me works also. :wink: )

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Post Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 4:58 pm 
 

I take it that you are differentiating between the CISO that was released digest size with some 12 loose maps, and the 'Revised books that were all released 8x11?

My '2nd print' has 80 pages, a glossy grey cover with red writing' 'Created and Approved...' and the '$8.00' centred at the bottom. The final entry on the last page product list is '97 Journal 15 (X)...........$1.50'

I don't know what the '1st Edition' copy is. I understood that the grey copy was the '1st Edition' of the 'Revised' City State. Was the earlier digest sized CSIO a 'Revised' edition?


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Post Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 5:07 pm 
 

mbassoc2003 wrote:I take it that you are differentiating between the CISO that was released digest size with some 12 loose maps, and the 'Revised books that were all released 8x11?

My '2nd print' has 80 pages, a glossy grey cover with red writing' 'Created and Approved...' and the '$8.00' centred at the bottom. The final entry on the last page product list is '97 Journal 15 (X)...........$1.50'

I don't know what the '1st Edition' copy is. I understood that the grey copy was the '1st Edition' of the 'Revised' City State. Was the earlier digest sized CSIO a 'Revised' edition?


Thanks for that info.
Yeah, I am differentiating this from the #3 (1st edition) and #12 (2nd edition)..in all then there are 7 'printings' of CSotIO books, 5 of which being the revised ones (8x11 sized)
So now I just need to confirm the 1st printing of the Revised CSotIO.

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Post Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 11:48 am 
 

Plaag wrote:
mbassoc2003 wrote:I take it that you are differentiating between the CISO that was released digest size with some 12 loose maps, and the 'Revised books that were all released 8x11?

My '2nd print' has 80 pages, a glossy grey cover with red writing' 'Created and Approved...' and the '$8.00' centred at the bottom. The final entry on the last page product list is '97 Journal 15 (X)...........$1.50'

I don't know what the '1st Edition' copy is. I understood that the grey copy was the '1st Edition' of the 'Revised' City State. Was the earlier digest sized CSIO a 'Revised' edition?


Thanks for that info.
Yeah, I am differentiating this from the #3 (1st edition) and #12 (2nd edition)..in all then there are 7 'printings' of CSotIO books, 5 of which being the revised ones (8x11 sized)
So now I just need to confirm the 1st printing of the Revised CSotIO.

ShaneG.

Could you post a pic' of what you believe is the 1st Revised? I only have the 2nd Print you discribe above, and a digest sized 1st edition.


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Post Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:55 pm 
 

mbassoc2003 wrote:
Plaag wrote:
Thanks for that info.
Yeah, I am differentiating this from the #3 (1st edition) and #12 (2nd edition)..in all then there are 7 'printings' of CSotIO books, 5 of which being the revised ones (8x11 sized)
So now I just need to confirm the 1st printing of the Revised CSotIO.

ShaneG.

Could you post a pic' of what you believe is the 1st Revised? I only have the 2nd Print you discribe above, and a digest sized 1st edition.


I don't have a pic, but I assume the 1st print revised is like the 2nd/3rd having the grey background and red letters (though price, item number, and perhaps a variation on the 'Created and Approved for use with Dungeons & Dragons' is different). The information that now confirms there are 4 revised printings is the copyrights/dating through booty list or treasure vaults of the last 3: 79/80/81. Confirming the first print is Journal (S) #64 having the Revised CSotIO stated as being the new version... in its Booty List (June/July 1978 mag), and the old info off the keltic site stating a copy has a JG item list that lists no releases after Village Book I (which dates it near April/May 1978).

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Post Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 5:10 am 
 

heres one for everyone to mull over. am quite interested in everyone elses thoughts on these as my thoughts on this DON'T tie in with any of the other websites.

#66 Sea Steeds and Wave Riders.

came out in 2 prints. the 1st is a white cover, the 2nd, a blue cover

now. on the other sites, it mentions that the 1st comes with the deck maps and the 2nd doesnt.

every 1st i have ever got my hands on, has NEVER had deck maps and the 2nds always have.

my thoughts are this:

#66 was originally released just as a book. they then released #69 flotilla one (which is just deck maps for #66). at a later point, they then re-printed #66 with the deckmaps.

what does everyone think or did the 1st actually come with deck maps anyway?

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Post Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 2:47 pm 
 

killjoy32 wrote:heres one for everyone to mull over. am quite interested in everyone elses thoughts on these as my thoughts on this DON'T tie in with any of the other websites.

#66 Sea Steeds and Wave Riders.

came out in 2 prints. the 1st is a white cover, the 2nd, a blue cover

now. on the other sites, it mentions that the 1st comes with the deck maps and the 2nd doesnt.

every 1st i have ever got my hands on, has NEVER had deck maps and the 2nds always have.

my thoughts are this:

#66 was originally released just as a book. they then released #69 flotilla one (which is just deck maps for #66). at a later point, they then re-printed #66 with the deckmaps.

what does everyone think or did the 1st actually come with deck maps anyway?

Al


Hum, well first we'd need to confirm if the blue or white was first (the notes I have on mine I could not date, and as to what cover it was..well I'll have to dig it out)
As to no map sheets..checking the catalogs/mags around that time they say 66 should have them, so I'd assume they came with the first. Now if in those same magazines there is an appology for not including them I can try and find out. (They have done it before after all)
Also from the catalogs one could buy just the guidebook:
66: Sea Steeds & Wave Riders ($6.50)
B01A Guidebook ($3.50)
M01E Deck Plans ($2.00)

So my question to you..were those in shrink? If so, then we really need to figure out what is the true first print.

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Post Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2005 12:37 am 
 

I bought "Flotilla One" back in 1985, believing it to be "Sea Steeds and Wave Riders."  Boy was I surprised when I got three identicle, puzzling sets of deck plans...and nothing else.  (Good thing I had that wooden raft deck plan...Lord knows a raft deck is much better use of space than a sailing ship deck!)

I had one of the sets of deck plans under glass on my desktop for years.


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Post Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2005 3:59 pm 
 

New Question Time!

Does anyone have maps that have copyright dates that differ from the following:
1977
#18 Judges Campaign Map 1--City State of Invincible Overlord
#19 Players Campaign Map 1--City State of Invincible Overlord
#44 Campaign Map #2/#3
#50 Campaign Map #4/#5
1980
#153 Judges Campaign Map 6-City State of the World Emperor
#154 Players Campaign Map 6-City State of the World Emperor
1978
Campaign Map #7/#8
Campaign Map #9/#10
1979
Campaign Map #11/#14
Campaign Map #12/#13
Campaign Map #15/#16 (plus what are the copyright dates on these)
Campaign Map #17/#18 (plus what are the copyright dates on these..saves me digging them out)

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Post Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:35 pm 
 

Come upon these questions recently:
What copyright dates and/or highest # in the booty list/treasure vault do your copies contain.
For: #76 Dragon Crown
#80 Of Skulls & Scrapfaggot Green
#88 Dark Tower

Does #92 Wilderlands of the Magic Realm that came with the installments (ie 16 page books) have the same covers
and  same question with #300 Wilderlands of the Fantastic Reaches.

I believe I had other questions that escaped my mind at the moment (damn poetry)..but jotted those down as I was working on the site.
ShaneG.

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Post Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 9:59 pm 
 

Plaag wrote:What copyright dates and/or highest # in the booty list/treasure vault do your copies contain.
#88 Dark Tower


My Dark Tower (which I got from you Shane, and thanks a bunch for that!) has no copyright date that I could find. The highest number in the booty list is #93 - Under the Storm Giant's Castle.

  


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Post Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 10:03 pm 
 

Plaag wrote:Campaign Map #15/#16 (plus what are the copyright dates on these)
Campaign Map #17/#18 (plus what are the copyright dates on these..saves me digging them out)


Did you get an answer for these? My 15/16 and 17/18 maps have copyright 1980 on them.

  

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Post Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 10:06 pm 
 

El Diablo Robotico wrote:
Plaag wrote:Campaign Map #15/#16 (plus what are the copyright dates on these)
Campaign Map #17/#18 (plus what are the copyright dates on these..saves me digging them out)


Did you get an answer for these? My 15/16 and 17/18 maps have copyright 1980 on them.


Thanks, you're the first to answer.

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Post Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 2:33 am 
 

Plaag wrote:Come upon these questions recently:
What copyright dates and/or highest # in the booty list/treasure vault do your copies contain.
For: #76 Dragon Crown
#80 Of Skulls & Scrapfaggot Green
#88 Dark Tower

Does #92 Wilderlands of the Magic Realm that came with the installments (ie 16 page books) have the same covers
and same question with #300 Wilderlands of the Fantastic Reaches.

I believe I had other questions that escaped my mind at the moment (damn poetry)..but jotted those down as I was working on the site.
ShaneG.


#92 wilderlands of the magic realms - the pictures on each instalment are totally different.

#76 dragon crown - i have two different prints of this one - one with a yellow cover and one white, they are both (c) 1979. yellow one doesnt have a booty list, but has a little section at the bottom on the back which says "more fine products from judges guild" - the highest item there is JG310 city of lei tabor $7.98. the white cover one DOES have a booty list, and the highest item there is #97 journal 15 (X) $1.50. i believe that makes the white cover copy the 1st print and the yellow cover copy the 2nd print.

#80 of skulls... i dont have an open copy of this one right now (only shrinked ones), so cant help you there :)

#88 dark tower - mine has (c) 1980 on the bottom of page 2 with all the usual blurb, and "dedicated to howard thompson because he gave me my first break". no booty list at the back, but there is a "treasure vault". the highest item therein, is i think, #710 amycus probe. it splits each game system seperately, instead of just one list, so makes it a little confusing really. the cover is the usual green one with the white border.

hope this helps.

Al



  

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Post Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 7:17 am 
 

killjoy32 wrote:
Plaag wrote:Come upon these questions recently:
What copyright dates and/or highest # in the booty list/treasure vault do your copies contain.
For: #76 Dragon Crown
#80 Of Skulls & Scrapfaggot Green
#88 Dark Tower

Does #92 Wilderlands of the Magic Realm that came with the installments (ie 16 page books) have the same covers
and same question with #300 Wilderlands of the Fantastic Reaches.

I believe I had other questions that escaped my mind at the moment (damn poetry)..but jotted those down as I was working on the site.
ShaneG.


#92 wilderlands of the magic realms - the pictures on each instalment are totally different.

#76 dragon crown - i have two different prints of this one - one with a yellow cover and one white, they are both (c) 1979. yellow one doesnt have a booty list, but has a little section at the bottom on the back which says "more fine products from judges guild" - the highest item there is JG310 city of lei tabor $7.98. the white cover one DOES have a booty list, and the highest item there is #97 journal 15 (X) $1.50. i believe that makes the white cover copy the 1st print and the yellow cover copy the 2nd print.

#80 of skulls... i dont have an open copy of this one right now (only shrinked ones), so cant help you there :)

#88 dark tower - mine has (c) 1980 on the bottom of page 2 with all the usual blurb, and "dedicated to howard thompson because he gave me my first break". no booty list at the back, but there is a "treasure vault". the highest item therein, is i think, #710 amycus probe. it splits each game system seperately, instead of just one list, so makes it a little confusing really. the cover is the usual green one with the white border.

hope this helps.

Al


On #92 is each book different in content, or is it the same in both. (rational here is that if they had different content and they were later combined, then they are not really 1st print/2nd print..more book 1, book 2)

#76: Had the 1st print, just didn't know the date of the 2nd (1980)

#88: first is 1979, the one you have is 1981 (both dated around june of those years actually to). I'm wondering if one was printed in 1980.

Thanks for that,
ShaneG.

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Post Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 7:30 am 
 

Plaag wrote:On #92 is each book different in content, or is it the same in both. (rational here is that if they had different content and they were later combined, then they are not really 1st print/2nd print..more book 1, book 2)


the first book (white cover - instalment V), relates to all the locations on one set of maps (12/13 i think) and the second book (blue cover - instalment W), relates to all the locations on the second set of maps (11/14 i think).

think it was either the 3rd or 4th print, where there is one book instead of two - i have it but am just to lazy to go look :D

and of course, the information detailed in the two 1st print books are different, as they relate to different maps.

so logically, there are two 1st prints, one for V and one for W.

Plaag wrote:#88: first is 1979, the one you have is 1981 (both dated around june of those years actually to). I'm wondering if one was printed in 1980.

Thanks for that,
ShaneG.


ummm mine is (c) 1980, not 1981 ?

Al

btw on that earlier #66 sea steeds, that i was on about. i have had about ooooh 40 different 1st prints off various different people and have never once had one in shrink and have never had the deck plans with it either. i have had about 5-6 different 2nd prints off various ppl and they have always had deck plans. i have about 20 shrinked 2nd prints here, and they all have deck plans.

i think the sequence was:

#66 sea steeds and wave riders - 1st print - no deck plans

#69 flotilla one - 1st print - deck plans for #66

#66 sea steeds and wave riders - 2nd print - with deck plans

i am sticking to that cos i am convinced its correct :D

Al



  

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Post Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 7:49 am 
 

killjoy32 wrote:
Plaag wrote:On #92 is each book different in content, or is it the same in both. (rational here is that if they had different content and they were later combined, then they are not really 1st print/2nd print..more book 1, book 2)


the first book (white cover - instalment V), relates to all the locations on one set of maps (12/13 i think) and the second book (blue cover - instalment W), relates to all the locations on the second set of maps (11/14 i think).

think it was either the 3rd or 4th print, where there is one book instead of two - i have it but am just to lazy to go look :D

and of course, the information detailed in the two 1st print books are different, as they relate to different maps.

so logically, there are two 1st prints, one for V and one for W.

Plaag wrote:#88: first is 1979, the one you have is 1981 (both dated around june of those years actually to). I'm wondering if one was printed in 1980.

Thanks for that,
ShaneG.


ummm mine is (c) 1980, not 1981 ?

Al

btw on that earlier #66 sea steeds, that i was on about. i have had about ooooh 40 different 1st prints off various different people and have never once had one in shrink and have never had the deck plans with it either. i have had about 5-6 different 2nd prints off various ppl and they have always had deck plans. i have about 20 shrinked 2nd prints here, and they all have deck plans.

i think the sequence was:

#66 sea steeds and wave riders - 1st print - no deck plans

#69 flotilla one - 1st print - deck plans for #66

#66 sea steeds and wave riders - 2nd print - with deck plans

i am sticking to that cos i am convinced its correct :D

Al


Sounds about right on 66/69. (course do you have a date/address, etc that can confirm a 2nd print date for #66 (both 1st print 66 and 69 are 1978)

As for the #88 (I have that one too) it says (c)1980, but treasure vault puts it at being 1981. (I'm hoping someone has one that says (c)1980 and has a booty list/treasure vault that dates it as 1980 also.)

Is there two printings of either book for #92? (If so then it is the 3rd print that the books are combined into a 48-page book, otherwise 2nd print)

ShaneG.

Edit: also you got a scan of #66 2nd print (the blue cover)?

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Post Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:13 am 
 

Well, now I have an update from information I received regarding this auction:

AD D DARK TOWER FANTASY GAME AID PAUL JAQUAYS JG 88 | eBay

(c)1979, but has a page stating new releases for #140/150 that puts it at 1980. Course I've asked for a scan of that page and a better one of the cover..so shall see.

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Post Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:50 am 
 

Plaag wrote:Well, now I have an update from information I received regarding this auction:

Dark Tower Game | eBay

(c)1979, but has a page stating new releases for #140/150 that puts it at 1980. Course I've asked for a scan of that page and a better one of the cover..so shall see.

ShaneG.


yeah i have been watching that one for a few days now, as well as a few other items that seller is offloading.

Al

ps. will sort a #66 2nd print scan out as & when i get a chance.

pp. #92 i think there might be a 2nd print the same as the 1st print. Ian will confirm this - he's the resident expert on wilderlands of the magic realms :D



  
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