killjoy32 wrote:well it would have been a cool acquisition if i hadnt fallen asleep 39 mins before the end....or used some of that crappy sniping stuff

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... %3AIT&rd=1

damn good fun find for some lucky chappie that.

Al

I put a snipe in on that, but I went too low. I thought I might get outbid, but it was going for such a low price with such little activity that I thought maybe I'd luck out. But I'm probably not as bummed as you, Al, cuz I'm not that big of a collector. Kind of a casual collector comparitively speaking.

Hey, what are those "dungeon levels" that I see beside the Judge's screen in that City State Ebay picture.

   Are the dungeon levels a part of the standard CSIO package?

   I have a few pages of dungeon levels that I bought included with a couple of other products.  Are they sought-after items?

   I mean...probably not, but maybe are they part of CSIO?

mbassoc2003 wrote:If you have those maps loose on coloured paper, they come from the original edition of the CSIO. Its the hardest one to get a hold of. There has only been two first edition in the past year to go on eBay and the first went to harami2000 (November) and the second was in toymom's auctions (but it wasn't mint or complete IIRC).

Y'know I can't honestly remember now, despite a few of us trying to help DeLaina package up the lots in a coherent fashion.

Pretty sure they wouldn't have been mint, if present (but probably somewhat better than the 1st print Men & Magic that Stephen snagged ).

mbassoc2003 wrote:A true first should fetch in the region of $100 but I don't know how saleable the maps on their own are.

Probably not, at present, unless Shane goes with a priced list of every item that isn't based purely on eBay realisations.
And even then, unsure...

£24 in January - That was back when I kept getting outbid on MRs and the other one.
Can't think who it was now


I'd seen them go for about £18 last year, which I thought was too much for me

BJS

PS - Ian - yes I need to reply to your PM

I am surprised at how much JG material actually made it over to England.  I  guess that role-playing games were at least as popular there as in America.

For you guys in England...what is your sense of the prevelance of D&D players during the heady days of the late 70's/early 80's?

Also, being English, can you tell the difference in "feel" between American products such as the AD&D Monster Manual and English products such as the original Fiend Folio?

   (If you don't know...a sip of the Fiend Folio tasted like tainted water to most American purchasers.  The art was lurid and the monsters included seemed rather odd.  Did it seem that way to someone from the British Isles market?)

    (Also, has anyone else ever read the monster credits in the Fiend Folio and noticed that all of the most popular, useful and enduring monsters were invented by one guy?)  

MShipley88 wrote:I am surprised at how much JG material actually made it over to England. I guess that role-playing games were at least as popular there as in America.

12-18 month lag, perhaps; hence few woodgrains or T1st Greyhawks, but definitely getting "on board" by the time PotVQ came out and getting up to speed as the first JG products rolled in.
*
Ditto for the keystone prozines (mid '77 vs mid '76).

Relative popularity is difficult to tell: certainly can't just link sales of TSR items to role-playing popularity as a whole.
Magazine circulation might suggest the UK was well ahead of the US on a per capita basis within a relatively short period... or else that each of us bought more 'zines over here... or even that WD's inclusiveness trumped TD's in-house approach

MShipley88 wrote:For you guys in England...what is your sense of the prevelance of D&D players during the heady days of the late 70's/early 80's?

Can't speak for England. Up North, however, we were having D&D products banned from all shops into the mid '80s.

MShipley88 wrote:(If you don't know...a sip of the Fiend Folio tasted like tainted water to most American purchasers. The art was lurid and the monsters included seemed rather odd. Did it seem that way to someone from the British Isles market?)

Not a particular favorite of mine, either; rather a hodgepodge (inevitable), but still of some use as a hardback to cart around rather than a stack of 'zines.

Still don't know why the Underworld Oracle monsters went uncredited with regards their original creators, no mention of Lou Nisbet and Phil Alexander (IIRC), or why no other fanzine submissions were considered.

MShipley88 wrote:(Also, has anyone else ever read the monster credits in the Fiend Folio and noticed that all of the most popular, useful and enduring monsters were invented by one guy?)

That famous Brit, Gary Gygax?

MShipley88 wrote:No, it wasn't Gygax.

Not even for his "why haven't you bought the modules yet?" inclusion of Kuo-Toa, Drow and Lolth?

MShipley88 wrote:I am speaking only from memory, but the guy I remember was named Charles Stross....or something very similar.

Yup, thought you might've meant him ( http://www.dungeonlord.co.uk/interviews/stross.htm ).
TSR did well not to get their knuckles rapped for transferring the casual name-borrowing of George Martin's githyanki into a TSR product.

MShipley88 wrote:I think my memory is accurate here....and it is significant that four of these creations remain highly popular/infamous in D&D circles to this day.

Agreed on that.

MShipley88 wrote:Aside from these, and the Fog Giant, there was quite a bit of head scratching over what to do with dozens of almost identicle 1/2 to 1 HD monsters...all described as lurking about dungeons looking to waylay sleeping adventurers. (Or something like that.... )

Heh, heh... just a slight over-generalisation, perhaps?

=
Hmm... *looks above*. JG forum... Oops; apologies, y'all!

El Diablo Robotico wrote:I got a 1st ed CSIO back in April for £24.05. Although it was not exactly in great condition, and it's missing the Thunderhold map (I was bummed by that). Speaking of which, here's what I got in my package:

Guide to the City State booklet (56 pages)
Guidelines Booklet I (27 pages)
Guidlines Booklet J (18 pages)
17"x22" Players map of the city
4 17"x22" quadrant maps of the city (which when pieced together form a 34"x44" map)
21"x28" Judges map of the city
21"x28" Players map of the city

Based on the descriptions on the keltic JG site, it looks like I got a couple of maps from the later revised edition.

The first edition CSIO came with a stack of loose maps of all the dungeon levels (about 9 of them) over and above the City maps and Thunderhold that you describe above. Were those with your package?

El Diablo Robotico wrote:

mbassoc2003 wrote:The first edition CSIO came with a stack of loose maps of all the dungeon levels (about 9 of them) over and above the City maps and Thunderhold that you describe above. Were those with your package?

YOINK! No they weren't. More stuff I'm missing. Damn!

*grump*

Now that we're on the subject, what's supposed to come with a revised edition of the city? I recently acquired the orange cover printing of revised. But I have no idea if it's complete.

Original CSIO: Guide to the City State (56-page booklet), yellow Booklet I (16-page booklet), Booklet J (12-page booklet), huge City State Map (34"x44" map - 4 sections), City State Player Map (17"x22" map), Judges Thunderhold/Sunstone Cavern Map (11"x17" map), Players Thunderhold Map (8.5"x11" map), Dungeon Level Maps I: Levels 1-5 (5 8.5"x11" maps), Dungeon Level Maps J: Levels 1-4 (4 8.5"x11" maps) and cover sheet.
Revised CSIO 4th Printing: (1981) Cover has red background with white lettering. ‘Official Playing Aid Approved for Dungeons & Dragons' on the cover along with small item number and price at bottom left corner. 6th edition is stated on the first page. 96 page book with 2 22.5"x28.5" maps (Judge, Player)

ShaneG.