Modron Maps?
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Post Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 10:53 pm 
 

Modron, 2nd or 3rd print:

It comes with two separate maps, are these the same map? Or two totally different maps?  I have quite a few of the Modron booklets, and a stack of the maps, but the maps are all one map.  Is there just two of these included with the booklet, or are there two different maps? Thanks!

Mike B.


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Post Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 6:24 am 
 

Badmike wrote:Modron, 2nd or 3rd print:

It comes with two separate maps, are these the same map? Or two totally different maps?  I have quite a few of the Modron booklets, and a stack of the maps, but the maps are all one map.  Is there just two of these included with the booklet, or are there two different maps? Thanks!

Mike B.


http://www.acaeum.com/jg/Item0031.html

2 separate maps, Judges is 11x17, Players is 8.5x11
The 4th print of the book includes these maps inside it.

Looking over Ebay it seems only 1 map is being sold with the Modrons.  I might have to check the 2nd & 3rd print books to see if the players map is in those but I swear it isn't.
Shall hopefully have an answer before football starts today :)

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Post Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 11:15 am 
 

My 3rd print has both maps, while it seems my 2nd print only has the Judges map.  However looking through the catalogs it appears both maps should be present - with some of the catalogs listing the Judges maps correct but the Players not specifying the blank hexes on its reverse.  Oddly the 4th print never is mentioned though 32 pages is stated earlier on then the 4th would be so without going back to pulling out my printings are the 2nd & 3rd print books 32 pages?

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Post Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 11:52 am 
 

The following are my thoughts on the Modron books, along with a listing of the Judges Guild Widlerlands sets and maps; which I know Mike was interested in.

ALL of the Modron Books except for the 2nd Edition-4th Prints should include TWO maps.
One is 11" x 17" Judges Map and shows the Town of Modron on one side and The Estuary of Ragloroon on the other side.
The other is 8-12" x 11" Players Map and shows the Town of Modron and has (IIRC) blank hexes on the other side (I did not dig out my copy to check).

From the Link that Shane provided in his first post above there is another link (the blue word Modron) to the BLUE Digest Sized Booklet "M", which is the original First Edition of the Town of Modron.
I know you (Mike) have at least one copy of Booklet "M".
It is the Blue Booklet with the sea serpent on the front cover; "Maelstron", the City States "Guardian of the Estuary".
I am not certain, but I think that (at least) the Judges Map (11" x 17") of Modron with the Estuary of Ragloroon on the reverse side would also go with that Blue Booklet (if not both maps).
There MIGHT be more than one printing of Booklet "M".

The larger books that were printed later showing the Town of Modron are all second edition books (Booklet "M" being the only first Edition).
They offer more details of the Estuary and the town itself; However, only the 2nd Ed-4th Print books have 32 pages, all others are 16 pages.

I do not have a copy of all printings of Modron (missing a 2nd Ed-1st and 2nd Ed-2nd)  However:
The 3rd print covers are hard heavy stock and the books have 16 pages.
These 16 page books have NO inserted maps and the back cover is an illustration of a grinning man missing a front tooth walking along a dark alley with a bottle held up high (The man is Probably drunk) and a Vampire is shown in the background... apparently stalking his next meal.
These books would need the TWO separate maps to be complete.

The 2nd Edition-4th print covers are the thinner newspaper style and so they are more flimsy (in comparison) and the books have 32 pages including more artwork, data and BOTH maps are included inside or on the book itself.
The players smaller map (in full color) is actually the back cover, showing the general area of the town and the tower on the peninsula jutting into the Estuary.
The center fold of the book is the larger 11" x 17" Judges Map with the City of Modron side printed in full color and the Estuary Map in B&W on the reverse side.
These 4th print books do not include or need the separate maps.

To avoid any confusion (or perhaps to add to it) There is another Bluish Booklet that is Titled "Initial Guidelines Booklet K".
This is part of the Haghill set, but the data blog indicates the maps might not have been included with the installment or Booklet "K" but were sold seperately.
http://www.acaeum.com/jg/Item0020.html
I am certain that you (Mike) now have a stack of Haghill maps which show the town, the fortress and the area around Haghill (the Map is called Huberik of Haghill).
I believe that map can be included with other Judges Guild products as well, but I do not recall which ones (I think one of the City State Sets).

As for the Wilderlands Maps I have listed below; the Wilderlands Set Title with the corresponding JG Product Code and what maps come with each set.

Wilderlands of High Fantasy (48.)
4 Maps; 2 Judges Maps and 2 Players Maps (2/3 and 4/5)

Fantastic Wilderlands Beyonde (67)
4 Maps; 2 Judges Maps and 2 Players Maps (7/8 and 9/10)

Wilderlands of the Magic Realm (92)
4 Maps: 2 Judges Maps and 2 Players Maps (12/13 and 11/14)

Wilderlands of the Fantastic Reaches (300)
4 Maps: 2 Judges Maps and 2 Players Maps (15/16 and 17/18.)

FYI:
Map One is the Campaign Map for the City State of the Invincible Overlord.
Map Six is the Campaign Map for the City State of the World Emperor.


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Post Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:55 pm 
 

Gnat the Beggar wrote:The following are my thoughts on the Modron books, along with a listing of the Judges Guild Widlerlands sets and maps; which I know Mike was interested in.

ALL of the Modron Books except for the 2nd Edition-4th Prints should include TWO maps.
One is 11" x 17" Judges Map and shows the Town of Modron on one side and The Estuary of Ragloroon on the other side.
The other is 8-12" x 11" Players Map and shows the Town of Modron and has (IIRC) blank hexes on the other side (I did not dig out my copy to check).

From the Link that Shane provided in his first post above there is another link (the blue word Modron) to the BLUE Digest Sized Booklet "M", which is the original First Edition of the Town of Modron.
I know you (Mike) have at least one copy of Booklet "M".
It is the Blue Booklet with the sea serpent on the front cover; "Maelstron", the City States "Guardian of the Estuary".
I am not certain, but I think that (at least) the Judges Map (11" x 17") of Modron with the Estuary of Ragloroon on the reverse side would also go with that Blue Booklet (if not both maps).
There MIGHT be more than one printing of Booklet "M".

The larger books that were printed later showing the Town of Modron are all second edition books (Booklet "M" being the only first Edition).
They offer more details of the Estuary and the town itself; However, only the 2nd Ed-4th Print books have 32 pages, all others are 16 pages.

I do not have a copy of all printings of Modron (missing a 2nd Ed-1st and 2nd Ed-2nd)  However:
The 3rd print covers are hard heavy stock and the books have 16 pages.
These 16 page books have NO inserted maps and the back cover is an illustration of a grinning man missing a front tooth walking along a dark alley with a bottle held up high (The man is Probably drunk) and a Vampire is shown in the background... apparently stalking his next meal.
These books would need the TWO separate maps to be complete.

The 2nd Edition-4th print covers are the thinner newspaper style and so they are more flimsy (in comparison) and the books have 32 pages including more artwork, data and BOTH maps are included inside or on the book itself.
The players smaller map (in full color) is actually the back cover, showing the general area of the town and the tower on the peninsula jutting into the Estuary.
The center fold of the book is the larger 11" x 17" Judges Map with the City of Modron side printed in full color and the Estuary Map in B&W on the reverse side.
These 4th print books do not include or need the separate maps.



You are absolutely correct on the 4th print, John. I popped open one of the SW Fantasy Game Aid packs (gasp!) and the Modron inside was a 4th print (newsprint style version) and had no extra maps except those included in the module itself. It is 32 pages while the 2nd and 3rd prints have only 16 pages.

It looks like from the descriptions I have a bunch of 3rd prints with only the Judges map.....unless I find a huge cache of players maps I'll have a bunch of usable, but incomplete copies to sell of that version.

So Booklet M (blue booklet) is a completely separate publication of the town, correct?

Mike B.


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Post Posted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 10:33 pm 
 

I am not sure yet (I will carefully compare my copies) but they may all have exactly the same data, or if not, then the newer prints might include a little more data that the Booklet "M" did not have.

Even with the additional artwork and the maps included, this would not  make up for the volume of the 4th prints (with 32 pages) compared with Booklet "M" with 16 pages and the 1st-3rd prints of the 16 page second edition books.


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Post Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:38 am 
 

Badmike wrote: I popped open one of the SW Fantasy Game Aid packs (gasp!)


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Post Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 1:02 pm 
 

Badmike wrote:
You are absolutely correct on the 4th print, John. I popped open one of the SW Fantasy Game Aid packs (gasp!) and the Modron inside was a 4th print (newsprint style version) and had no extra maps except those included in the module itself. It is 32 pages while the 2nd and 3rd prints have only 16 pages.

Mike B.


Well since you opened it, could you state what printing the other products are.  3738/3740 possibly still in SW (I think I have this and it's no longer in SW either) :)

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Post Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:53 am 
 

Plaag wrote:
Well since you opened it, could you state what printing the other products are.  3738/3740 possibly still in SW (I think I have this and it's no longer in SW either) :)

ShaneG.


Shane;

I checked all the printings on the Fantasy Game Aid Pack today, they are the last prints of all the materials listed (makes sense if this was put together in 1981, these are the final prints of all the materials).

Mike B.


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Post Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:59 am 
 

Hmmm... my 2nd printing (16 pages... not including the stiff cover pages) also only has a (11x17) Judges Map.  How strange... now I am wondering if they didn't have a Player Map with that batch.  Weird.  How could several of us have the same result with our copies, otherwise?  If not, I guess I need to also seek out a Players Map for that copy to become complete.  ;)  Can anyone here with a 2nd print confirm that it came with both maps?

Anyway, I also have a 4th print copy (32 pages... including the cover pages) and the maps are all printed in the booklet... including the Player Map (on the back cover) with the blank hexes on the opposite side.  In this printing, the City of Modron maps (both Judges and Player) are in color.

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Post Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 8:22 am 
 

Katchoo wrote:Hmmm... my 2nd printing (16 pages... not including the stiff cover pages) also only has a (11x17) Judges Map.  How strange... now I am wondering if they didn't have a Player Map with that batch.  Weird.  How could several of us have the same result with our copies, otherwise?  If not, I guess I need to also seek out a Players Map for that copy to become complete.  ;)  Can anyone here with a 2nd print confirm that it came with both maps?

Anyway, I also have a 4th print copy (32 pages... including the cover pages) and the maps are all printed in the booklet... including the Player Map (on the back cover) with the blank hexes on the opposite side.  In this printing, the City of Modron maps (both Judges and Player) are in color.

~Kat  ^_^


Thats exactly what I've found, Kat.  Apparently the Players maps are as rare as hen's teeth. However, you really only need the Judges map anyway, so I guess a lot of people have overlooked this over the years.   Can anyone scan a Players map just for the heck of it?

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Post Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 11:07 pm 
 

Badmike wrote:
Thats exactly what I've found, Kat.  Apparently the Players maps are as rare as hen's teeth. However, you really only need the Judges map anyway, so I guess a lot of people have overlooked this over the years.   Can anyone scan a Players map just for the heck of it?

Mike B.

Because of this finding, I'm wondering if the Modron 2nd print entry needs to be updated on this site.  lol

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Post Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 10:14 am 
 

Unless you bought it in shrink I'm going to have to say not so fast.  I checked catalogs, dungeoneers, journals, etc for anything to support this theory which perked my interest.  Almost all of the catalogs baring I believe the 80's distributor catalog lists item #31 which is both maps for Modron.  Then we get Dungeoneer 11, 14-15, Journal 18-21, Dungeoneer Journal 19/22, Pegasus 3-6 doing the same.
Greater evidence starts in the Spring catalog from 1980 which pictures the new Modron book.  Its description contains both Judges & Players map and the newly revised 16pg book.  I could not find any mention of the new revised Modron in the editors comments of some of the various magazines around that time - sort of miss all the info Bob used to provide in the early journals.

I know there is tons of info the Bledsaws have as to various products and order dates (along with art, etc) as I've seen various papers on the day of Bob's funeral when Mishler had a box he was given by Bob..and he rightfully gave it back to the family.

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Post Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 12:38 pm 
 

To add to the mystery/conspiracy... an RPG reseller I know has a pile of 2nd prints and NONE of them have player maps!   8O  Can one single person out there confirm a 2nd print copy that has the player map?  We need confirmation!!!  lol

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Post Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 5:06 pm 
 

My 2nd ed., 2nd printing has the players map.  Not being shrink wrapped I can not swear that it originally came that way.  My 3rd print is shrink wrapped and it also has the players map.

  

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Post Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 5:42 pm 
 

leadjunkie wrote:My 2nd ed., 2nd printing has the players map.  Not being shrink wrapped I can not swear that it originally came that way.  My 3rd print is shrink wrapped and it also has the players map.

Ah!  But at least we finally found someone with a 2nd print that has the map.  lol  Now if we can find a shrink-wrapped one, we can put this to rest.  ;)  I still wonder why we have come across so many without the Player Map.  Weirdness.  :)

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Post Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 6:16 pm 
 

Yeh strange, I have an entire case without the players map.

Mike B.


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Post Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 11:23 pm 
 

Badmike wrote:Yeh strange, I have an entire case without the players map.

Mike B.

Yup... sounds like my friend too.  I wonder if there was some sort of glitch with certain batches of them or something.  So odd.

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Post Posted: Wed May 04, 2011 3:12 pm 
 

I just received a 3rd print that included the ever elusive double sided Players Map (8-1/2" x 11") and the double sided Judges Map (11" x 17").

The Book has 16 numbered pages, plus the un-numbered covers.



It is nothing more than a playing copy, yet I paid higher than I might have for a SWed copy of an equally common Judges Guild product.

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And yes, I totally overpaid for this one, BECAUSE it included the Player's Map, and I suspect I HAD to pay more for the same reason.


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 5:28 pm 
 

I have your confirmation regarding the small and large map for the 2nd print.

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Recently purchased this 2nd Print Modron in original Shrink Wrap.

There are two maps along with the thinner 16 page book.



Since it has the loose SW, I was able to hold the edges on each side of the package and slightly manipulate the package; bending it enough so that it was obvious that there is one large folded map and one smaller map inside it.



And NO I am not going to rip the Shrink... 8)


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