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Post Posted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 4:27 pm 
 

I haven't collected the Necromancer Games products seriously yet, and I'm wondering what their content is like and which ones are htf.
Can anyone tell me where to start?
The copies I have (through chance good deals, from what I can tell) are G4 and G6.
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Post Posted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 5:00 pm 
 

I'd start with the biggies: Tomb of Abysthor, Rappan Athuk (you can buy R1-3 or pay more and buy the boxed set), the Judges Guild stuff (CSIO and Wilderlands), but to be boldly honest, none of the stuff published is bad per se, as a publisher (unlike say Goodman Games, Troll Lord Games, etc.) their workd are consistently high quality and well presented.

Prices are generally still quite high for the more popular choices, and seem to be holding. I'll leave you to find out which are the rares and which are not. You can also find good deals in bundles on eBay from time to time, particularly when private sellers are shifting collections.

I'm sure the more active readers/players among us will have more constructive advice from a gameplay point of view. I'm just a dealer at the moment.


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Post Posted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 6:53 pm 
 

Some "experts" here are probably going to say that these are ultra rare but really none of them are rare but certainly some are more in demand than others.  By in demand it means that they sell for around 1-1.5 time cover price.  The most in demand is the Rappan Athuk Reloaded boxed set and it is probably the rarest with "only" 1000 copies being made.  Valuations are up and down.  Noble Knight had copies for sale and 1 in shrink for $160 (I think) a couple of months ago - probably $150-$180 is about right (cover price was $100).



I'm not sure if any others are really worth significantly more than cover price.  The Wilderlands boxed set come in around $75-$100 with cover price of $70.  CSIO hardcover book currently sells around $45 (cover price of $35).



Lots of people seem to like boxed sets.  The other Necromancer Games boxed set is City of Brass but that can be had for less than cover price.



Necromancer Games themselves have a lot of stuff on Ebay right now:



eBay listings



But most of their valuations are flat out ridiculous.  They do however suggest that the K series might be less common.  A seller last summer blew out a number of these sets of books for cheap though so I think it means that they probably have a ton of copies left.



Most of their books are good.  If you are thinking about trying to get a set of them all, then I would start by finding most of the common stuff that is going for $5 or less and in the meantime, keep your eye out for some of the more in demand books that might sell a bit on the lower side.

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Post Posted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 10:48 pm 
 

Mars wrote:Last time I looked Barakus was still selling for a higher amount but I guess its value is dropping off as well.  A number of the other Necro books can be had for cheap cheap cheap these days too.


** expired eBay auction **



** expired eBay auction **



** expired eBay auction **



** expired eBay auction **



** expired eBay auction **


At least this rare copy of K9 managed to get a 99 cent bid :)


** expired eBay auction **




Well, mayhemcomics is selling them for cheap.  That's for sure.  8O



I have noticed a tendency among collectors to chase after certain items because they are high priced.



(A part of it has to do with what one considers "high."  For me, any purchase over $10 requires reflection.  A purchase of $20 requires a good reason.  A purchase of $30 means I want the item bad and I see no other options.  Some people here would laugh at the idea of $30 being expensive.)



The point I have been making is that the Necromancer publications are cheap...which is why collectors should snap them up right now before they get expensive.



Right now is the 'doh! moment people will look back on when they realize that the D20 modules were once on the discount shelf for $1.



The Raise the Dead listing, which I believe I mentioned here, is something that should have been pounced on.  If you're reading this because you're new to collecting and want to know where to start then my advice to you is to get these cheap items now.











.


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Post Posted: Fri Jun 04, 2010 11:29 pm 
 

Hey, new collector!  

I am not a real clever collector.  I am more of a hobbyist who bumbles about like Peter Rabbit in Mr. MacGregor's garden, hoping the cat won't get me and losing my coat crawling under the gate.

That said, from the point of view of someone who is not a re-seller and (relatively speaking) not a big spender, I offer you the:

D20 COLLECTING ADVICE OF THE DAY

Watch for sell-offs.

A lot of D20 stuff originally hit the market for way over-inflated prices.  With so much material on store shelves those modules sat there for half a decade until D20 was supplanted by D&D 4.0....WOTC's own version of New Coke.

Most game stores discounted these items and unloaded them.  The other game stores did what game stores usually do...they went out of business.  

Most game store owners are also hobbyists, who fully intend to re-open.  It takes them a year or two to figure out that is not going to happen.  Then they unload the boxes in their garage to a distributor like...for instance...Troll and Toad.

If you watch, you will notice a tendency for numbers of similar products to appear on the market at the same time for a very reduced price.

Mayhemcomics (mentioned above), for instance, has obviously acquired the stock of a failed store, or some similar source, and they are dumping the modules for cheap.  The fire sale will last only as long as Mayhemcomics has stock to dump.  Then it will be gone.

The same thing is happening at Troll and Toad right now, where the entire run of Goodman Games' 4.0 Dungeon Crawl Classics line is being dumped off in complete lots.  Troll and Toad has a lot of them, so the source was probably Goodman Games themselves (because of the whole D&D 4.0 New Coke thing).  They have so many of these lots that the price has actually dropped in recent weeks.

These sell-offs do not last.  The seller runs out of dump-off stock.  The dump-off stock was bought by small collectors and enthusiasts, who will hang onto it forever.  But a lot of it was purchased for re-sale by second tier Ebay re-sellers.  

When the dump-off ends, the D20 items re-appear on Ebay, listed by the second tier re-sellers.  Sometimes, the second tier re-sellers actually have the dump-off stocked marked-up on Ebay before the dump-off sale ends, because there's always a buyer who does not know the score.

If you want a D20 item, the time to buy is during the dump-off.  Don't be disuaded by the idea that no one wants these items and they will always be around.  They won't.

A good example of this can be seen in what happened to Judges Guild collecting over the past five years.  When I got into collecting Judges Guild stuff there were a lot of items listed for 99 cents.  The prices for more rare items ranged from $3 up to $30, with a lot of mid-range popular publications up around the $15 mark.  

There were a lot of Ebay Judges Guild re-sellers around because cargo container stocks of the publications had surfaced in two or more locations around the country.  The stock passed around in very large lots between re-sellers and appeared on Ebay from multiple sources.

Now, Judges Guild common items are still available in the $3 range.  There are very few 99 cent deals.  The  $30 items are now around $75-$100.  Those items are not what I'm talking about here.

It is the mid-range items you should pay attention to.  I bought several of the Wilderlands adventure series modules in the $15 range.  I bought Dark Tower for $20 and a second copy for $9.95.  I bought two copies of Caverns of Thracia for around $5.  I bought Inferno, just as it started to take off, at under $20.

Go and check on the prices for those items now.

Judges Guild is not a perfect metaphor for the D20 items because the glut was so huge.  But, just for fun, check on the prices for shrinkwrapped bundles of Judges Guild magazines.  I have several of those shrinkwrapped bundles because they were around $2 apiece and no one wanted them!

My interest in Judges Guild led me to Necromancer Games.  Back a few years ago, copies of the Necromancer Games City State of the Invincible Overlord were sometimes getting no bids in the $10 range.  I picked one up at $10 thinking I was being foolish.  

I stupidly passed on copies of the Necromancer Wilderlands of High Adventure boxed sets for $12, $15, $25...$35...and then I realized that I had been stupid, but it was too late.

Point is...in case anyone is still reading...dump-offs are a limited opportunity. They go away.  Higher prices follow.  Do not be lulled into waiting on these items just because they are only 99 cents.  Get them now, or pay the re-seller much much more than that a year or so from now.


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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:29 am 
 

Okay, that's great. I was thinking of concentrating on the G, K, and possibly D series, with F3 thrown in if I can get it.
Since I've already got the R1-3 (thanks to enthusiasts here!), I didn't include them. I've got Abysthor as well (I keep forgetting that one for some reason).
Right now, it's cheap modules over the pocket book-slaughtering boxed sets <sad>.
I'm glad that NG is consistently great for content (I want either the playing or collecting potential).
BTW: What do you think?:
Golden age: 1979 and earlier (OD&D, Basic, and very early 1st Edition);
Silver Age: 1980-2000 approx. (most 1st Edition and all 2nd Edition AD&D);
Bronze Age: 2001+ (d20/3rd Edition).
I know the dates don't line up in the usual color-coding way (I'm not sure of the exact cut-off for each Edition), but this is the way I think of collecting.
In general, I don't think 4th Edition will ever be as collectable as prior Editions. Low print runs on some items will be the exceptions.
Gary

  

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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:03 pm 
 

The D&D Encounters adventures seems to fecth a nice price (nice if you are the seller of course  :P ): I sold some days ago a copy of the first Undermountain adventure, with admittedly a lot of extras, for around £ 50  8O Am I the only seller to have such experience?

  

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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:41 pm 
 

Alexander1968 wrote:The D&D Encounters adventures seems to fecth a nice price (nice if you are the seller of course  :P ): I sold some days ago a copy of the first Undermountain adventure, with admittedly a lot of extras, for around £ 50  8O Am I the only seller to have such experience?


Do you mean the D20 Expedition to books?  Or is there another Undermountain book?  I'm not familiar with the "D&D Encounters" line.

With minimal searching, the Expedition to books can be found for less than $10 each.

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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:31 pm 
 

Mars wrote:
Do you mean the D20 Expedition to books?  Or is there another Undermountain book?  I'm not familiar with the "D&D Encounters" line.

With minimal searching, the Expedition to books can be found for less than $10 each.


Where could I find Expedition to Castle Greyhawk for that price?


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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:38 pm 
 

puterdragon wrote:Okay, that's great. I was thinking of concentrating on the G, K, and possibly D series, with F3 thrown in if I can get it.
Since I've already got the R1-3 (thanks to enthusiasts here!), I didn't include them. I've got Abysthor as well (I keep forgetting that one for some reason).
Right now, it's cheap modules over the pocket book-slaughtering boxed sets <sad>.
I'm glad that NG is consistently great for content (I want either the playing or collecting potential).
BTW: What do you think?:
Golden age: 1979 and earlier (OD&D, Basic, and very early 1st Edition);
Silver Age: 1980-2000 approx. (most 1st Edition and all 2nd Edition AD&D);
Bronze Age: 2001+ (d20/3rd Edition).
I know the dates don't line up in the usual color-coding way (I'm not sure of the exact cut-off for each Edition), but this is the way I think of collecting.
In general, I don't think 4th Edition will ever be as collectable as prior Editions. Low print runs on some items will be the exceptions.
Gary


I would date the Golden Age all the way up to 1980, 1982 or even as high as 1985.

It depends on what you consider "golden."

One possible dividing line in AD&D would be the shift from monochrome to four color module covers...but there are a few classics that fall into the four color era.

For me, the Golden Age ended when 2nd Edition was announced...right around late 1985.

You could also date it from the official ouster of Gary Gygax...the day he was locked out of his office.

Also, I don't think the Silver Age extended all the way to 2000.  There as an intermediate period in the 90's where 2nd Edition D&D was basically treading water and starting to sink.  Read the DRAGON magazines from the late 90's, just before the sale of TSR to Wizards of the Coast.  You'll see the quality difference...generally listless nature of the publication.

Ironically, some of the strongest DRAGON magazine issues were in the 100-120 range, at the end, or just after the end, of the Golden Age.


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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 4:45 pm 
 

FormCritic wrote:

Where could I find Expedition to Castle Greyhawk for that price?





** expired eBay auction **




No idea what the final bid will be, the next lowest is $15 + shipping.



These were going for under $10 several months back, but recently the price has creeped up to around $15 + shipping.



I did see one sell for $5 but the shipping was $14



It is a common mistake , or an easy way to try to undervalue an item, by ignoring the shipping cost. The tactic by sellers on ebay is to offer low prices but heavily pad the shipping costs.  You have to take the cost+shipping to actually value an item in these cases.

  

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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 5:25 pm 
 

I have shedloads of these if anyone is looking for a copy in the UK.
Have Exped to Undermountain too.


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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:35 pm 
 

FormCritic wrote:
It depends on what you consider "golden."



Pretty much whatever was current whenever you were 12 :)

(formula works for basically anything that would have a 'golden age': baseball, movies, etc.)

Thanks for the D20 write-up Mark, I agree there's still lots of decent stuff the might turn into long-term collectibles, and at sell-off prices, it's not too tough to put together a collection of good quality material.

  

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Post Posted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:55 pm 
 

FormCritic wrote:
It is the mid-range items you should pay attention to.  I bought several of the Wilderlands adventure series modules in the $15 range.  I bought Dark Tower for $20 and a second copy for $9.95.  I bought two copies of Caverns of Thracia for around $5.  I bought Inferno, just as it started to take off, at under $20.



Is this the kind of stuff you are talking about?

http://paizo.com/store/games/roleplayin ... ragonlance

I received an e-mail from Paizo which said,

Prices Fit for a Kender!
Dragonlance classics at 50% off!

Jeff has been at it again! After my own success with the It's Good to Be King Clearance Sale, Jeff had to go out and find his own bargains for the store. So when our distributor, Alliance Games, gave Jeff a heads-up that they were closing out all of the Dragonlance 3rd Edition books, Jeff jumped on every copy that Alliance had in stock—so now we're bringing you the last of the 3rd Edition Dragonlance books at 50% off!

We have lots of cool Dragonlance books, from Wizards of the Coast's original Dragonlance Campaign Setting to a whole bunch of the Margaret Weis Productions books, including the classic Bestiary of Krynn—Revised Edition, Dragons of Krynn, and Races of Ansalon. For those of you looking for Dragonlance adventures, you'll want to check out Dragons of Spring, Age of Mortals II—Spectre of Sorrows, and Age of Mortals III—Price of Courag e.

Jeff cleared Alliance out of their stock, but many of these books won't last long—especially at 50% off! So get your orders in today before they disappear, like your pocketbook around a kender!


I have many of the Dragonlance modules, but I'm not that interested in most of this stuff even though some of it looks interesting.


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Post Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 12:33 am 
 

FormCritic wrote:Where could I find Expedition to Castle Greyhawk for that price?




I think I have 7 copies of them.  There is a UK seller that is dumping all of these books for under $10 each so that market is completely flooded:




** expired eBay auction **




But shipping the North America is high (for those that need to do it) - I bought a large stack of stuff from here when he was offering shipping for 1 pound sterling in the UK.



I also ended up buying 2 or 3 copies at Christmas time locally for $2 each (no shipping cost).  From this place:




** expired eBay auction **

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Post Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 1:09 am 
 

benjoshua wrote:Is this the kind of stuff you are talking about?

http://paizo.com/store/games/roleplayin ... ragonlance


50% off cover prices still seems high.  Troll and Toad was blowing out a lot of this stuff a while back too although it looks out of stock at the moment:

http://www.trollandtoad.com/p170419.html

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Post Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 9:19 am 
 

Mars wrote:

Do you mean the D20 Expedition to books?  Or is there another Undermountain book?  I'm not familiar with the "D&D Encounters" line.

With minimal searching, the Expedition to books can be found for less than $10 each.




Not at all. WotC launched an organized play (sort of) this year with an adventure divided in various chapters, each chapter to be played each week. They produced a complete module, Halaster's Lost Apprentice, for D&D 4.0 along a series of playing aids (full colour character sheets, Monster token and so on) to be used during the weekly gaming sessions. I had one copy to spare and after finishing the program (next week a new Dark Sun Module starts to be used) I checked prices on eBay and... WOW  8O



This was my own listing. It lasted two days!



http://cgi.ebay.com/D-D-Encounters-Hala ... 563d07c559



PS: I have a copy of the Dark Sun module to spare too, but I will NOT sel it until the program is finished.

  


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Post Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 9:30 am 
 

Alexander1968 wrote:

Not at all. WotC launched an organized play (sort of) this year with an adventure divided in various chapters, each chapter to be played each week. They produced a complete module, Halaster's Lost Apprentice, for D&D 4.0 along a series of playing aids (full colour character sheets, Monster token and so on) to be used during the weekly gaming sessions. I had one copy to spare and after finishing the program (next week a new Dark Sun Module starts to be used) I checked prices on eBay and... WOW  8O

This was my own listing. It lasted two days!


** expired eBay auction **


PS: I have a copy of the Dark Sun module to spare too, but I will NOT sel it until the program is finished.




I'll go out on a limb here and crown myself one of the resident 4th Edition experts. :) Actually, Alexander, they released the organized play (called Delve Night) in 2008 (Oct to be exact). They released a total of 9 adventures in this first wave of organized play. They are 4 sheets of double sided sturdy heavy cardstock, with a total of 4 encounters contained therein. I personally have 4 of the 9 encounter sets, and have been looking for them for quite some time on eBay. The NEW wave of organized play is called D&D Encounters, and yes indeed, Dark Sun begins this Wednesday! I run it at a local store, so I get the copies of the adventures when we're finished. :)



As an aside, I am extremely interested in getting the remaining Delve Night adventures I need. I actually have extras of some of the modules I can trade to help people finish their runs as well. Just fire me a PM and I am sure we can work something out.



I'll just fade into the background here until further 4E expertise is required. ;)



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Post Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 2:44 pm 
 

benjoshua wrote:
I have many of the Dragonlance modules, but I'm not that interested in most of this stuff even though some of it looks interesting.


My own quote about the "mid-range" items pertained to the prices from five years ago specifically for Judges Guild items.

I was thinking, for instance, about The Fantastic Wilderlands Beyond that sat around in Fencert's store for a year at $14.99...in shrinkwrap...with no takers.  He had multiple copies that just sat there.  The same was true for Caverns of Thracia...multiple copies that were not being snapped up.

A brand new Caverns of Thracia goes for how much today?  The Fantastic Wilderlands Beyond in shrinkwrap would fetch...what?

A large number of the $3 Judges Guild items appeared on Ebay repeatedly as re-listings when there were no bidders.  Those items are much much less common right now.

Those Dragonlance materials on Paizo strike me as over-priced at 50% off.  

But...then again...I am biased against Dragonlance in general.  I always considered it to be an inferior setting.  It always seemed to me to be more suited for a Saturday morning cartoon.

A $14 purchase would be a large one for me.  I would be lurking these items until Paizo gets serious and lists them for between $2 and $5.


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Post Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 6:17 pm 
 

FormCritic wrote:
I would date the Golden Age all the way up to 1980, 1982 or even as high as 1985.

It depends on what you consider "golden."

One possible dividing line in AD&D would be the shift from monochrome to four color module covers...but there are a few classics that fall into the four color era.

For me, the Golden Age ended when 2nd Edition was announced...right around late 1985.

You could also date it from the official ouster of Gary Gygax...the day he was locked out of his office.

Also, I don't think the Silver Age extended all the way to 2000.  There as an intermediate period in the 90's where 2nd Edition D&D was basically treading water and starting to sink.  Read the DRAGON magazines from the late 90's, just before the sale of TSR to Wizards of the Coast.  You'll see the quality difference...generally listless nature of the publication.

Ironically, some of the strongest DRAGON magazine issues were in the 100-120 range, at the end, or just after the end, of the Golden Age.


I've liked the categorization of D&D collectables along Edition changes so far. The challenge for me is to attach an exact date for each change.

But there's good reason to categorize along company changes as well, since style and content vary with the company. More specificly, begin each era with the first publication under the new company in each case. I'm wondering:
1. What was the copyright date of TSR's first publication?
2. What was the copyright date of WotC's first publication?

Or back to the first approach--to categorize on the Editions' first publication dates:
1. What was the copyright date of TSR/Gygax's first 1st Edition publication?
2. What was the copyright date of TSR's first 2nd Edition publication?
3. What was the copyright date of WotC's first 3rd Edition publication?

Or a third option--to categorize based on specific publications that best represented or signalled a change between eras.

Because I was 14 when I started D&D gaming, I relate easily to publications from the late golden/early silver ages (1980-1990).

I'm unclear about what these dates are, otherwise I'd be clear(er) on establishing firmer delineations.
I think what's required is to establish two or three dates here--by consensus--and then the eras can be attached.
I believe D&D has joined the likes of other cultural collectables, so I thought I'd put forward these suggestions and questions to see how Acaeum members think about the eras.
Gary

  
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