Domesday Book: Research Report
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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:19 pm 
 

Domesday Book
The Official Newsletter of the Castle & Crusade Society
...citing:
IFW        International Federation of Wargamers
C&CS        Castle & Crusade Society
LGTSA        Lake Geneva Tactical Studies Association

Credits 1970:
King (Chief Executive)        Rob Kuntz
Steward (Asst. Executive)        Gary Gygax
Chief Scrivener (Ed./Publ.)        Christopher Schleicher
Asst. Scrivner (Typist)        Debbie Kocis
Chamberlain (Treasurer)        Terry Kuntz
Lord Prince of Arms (Heraldry)        William Linden
Pursuivant of Arms (Asst. Herald)        Dave Arneson
Justicar (PBM Judge)        Russell Tulp
Sheriff*        H. Axel Krigsman
* Gamesmaster for "Crusadomacy"

#1        (data unknown; editor Gary Gygax)
#2        (data unknown)
#3        (data unknown)
#4        (data unknown)

#5        July 1970
       LGTSA Miniatures Rules, by Jeff Perren with Gary Gygax
       Crusadomancy: Diplomacy Variant for the Middle Ages
       The Herald's Scroll, by William Linden
       The Armory, by Ken Scher
       The Broadside, by Ken Scher
       Jesting (cartoons)
       Tigers of the Sea, by Dave Arneson
       Odds and Ends (including GenCon III news)
       Battle Report, by Stephen A. Thomas Jr.

6        August 1970
       Medieval Japan, by Gary Gygax
       Sailing Ships through the Years (well illustrated but uncredited)
       Sand Table Roads, uncredited
       Germany in the Middle Ages, by Terry Kuntz
       Knights' Jousting Tourney (uncredited, presumed Russell Tulp)
       The Fyte by the Ford, by Stefen Kwiatkowski (with rules)
       Hand Cannon, uncredited
       Burnaby Medieval Rules (B.C. Chapter, Model Generals' Club)
       The Evolution of the Wargamer, by Rick Crane
       Financial Statement, by  Terry Kuntz
       Curia Regis (uncredited, probably by Rob Kuntz)
       Court Jester's Letter (uncredited, but Jester in Membership List is Chris Johnson)
       Membership List (31 people)
       Missives

7        September 1970
       Whose Rules are These?, by Gary Gygax (medieval miniatures)
       Maybe Dracula Wasn't as Bad as Legends Say, by World Journal Tribune
       An Analysis of China's Military Development, by Rick Crane
       Fortification, by Ken Scher
       Barbaria, by Russell Tulp (Diplomacy variant)
       Dark Ages, Medieval Conflict on Alternate World "Entropy", by Gary Gygax (with map & Bibliography)
       Missives
       Chamberlain's Report
       Membership List
       Curia Regis

8        (undated, presumed late 1970)
       Hard Men - Hard Times (reprint) (fiction from "Fighting Men", 1963)
       Hand to Hand?, by Ken Scher
       The Disappearance of the Longbow, by Gary Gygax
       A Few Notes on Polish Heraldry, by Stefen Kwiatkowski
       Elephant Armour, from Ken Scher
       From the Chief Scrivner

9        (data unknown)
       (may include details on the overthrow of King Kuntz)

10        (undated but 1971)
       (Credits note: King is Gary Gygax; Rob Kuntz not mentioned; Position of Steward/Asst. Executive now available; all material now © 1971 IFW C&CS, c/o Gary Gygax)
       Attributed Arms, by William Linden
       The Herald's Scroll, by William Linden
       The Roll of Arms, by William Linden (heraldry of members)
       The Battle of Barnet, by Franklin Hamilton (from the book "Challenge for a Throne")
       Medieval Oared Warships of the Mediterranean, by Ken Scher
       Story of Pygmalion, by Tom Webster
       Behold the Terrible Turk, by Ken Scher
       (GenCon IV preview note)
       Announcement, by Tom Webster (Ancients Society Report, Last Issue, 4/30/71)

11        (undated but 1971)
       (Credits note: King is Rob Kuntz again; Steward/Asst. Executive Dave Arneson; Gary Gygax not mentioned; all material © 1971 IFW C&CS, c/o Rob Kuntz; Published by Deborah & Christopher Schleicher [Chicago], Illustrations courtesy of Steve Unstead)
       Janos Hunyadi -- Borderer, by Stephen Gilbert Unstead (with Bibliography)
       Medieval Fortifications, by Ken Scher
       (Bulletin: Rob I Regains Kingship!)
       The Disparity Between Medieval Ideals and Reality, by Ken Scher
       Naval Warfare, Pre-Gunpowder Period, by Ken Scher
       First Jousting Report, by Russell Tulp
       LGTSA Medieval Miniatures: Rules Changes, by Gary Gygax
       Chamberlain's Report, by Terry Kuntz

[interregnum, then last gasps:]

12        June 1972        Lincolnshire, submitted by Dave Arneson
       The Purge, by Walter J. Williams
       Missives (credit note: Chief Scrivner has been dismissed due to lack of articles)
       Questionaire

13        July 1972
       (Credits note: King & Steward still Kuntz & Arneson, but "original editor and founder E. Gary Gygax")
       The Storming of Minas Ithil (part 1), by
       Facts about Black Moor, by Dave Arneson (with map of the vicinity)
       Feudal Kingship, by Terry Kuntz
       Missives
       Letter from the King, by Rob Kuntz (explanation of delays, appeal for articles; no more back issues available; mentions sending postcards to 80 members)
       Paper Models?, by Louis Bergeron
       Precedence by Title or Office (reprinted from issue 7)
       (2-page ad for Panzerfaust Magazine)
       Knights' Jousting Tourney (reprinted from issue 6)


14         August 1972 (never published/distributed)

1        Cover Illustration: Armored knight with hand-and-a-half sword, side view; plus flag on pike-pole
2        Title, List of Officers (credits as #13), Table of Contents
3        The Storming of Minas Ithil (conclusion; part 1 in #13) & Afterword
4        Cartoon
5        Missives, #1 of 3-part letter from Steve Ulmstead (Kt.)
6        Cartoon
7        Ad for Lowry's Hobbies (Belleville, IL) featuring 15% Discount on Avalon Hill games, also with Full-size Replicas of Famous Guns and Ballantine Books' series "Illustrated History of World War II"

  

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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:24 pm 
 

Membership and Precedence List (per issue 7, 9/1/70):               
              
1        Rob Kuntz        (King)
2        Gary Gygax        (Steward, Earl Palatine, OMSC)
3        Bill Linden        (Lord Price of Arms, Viscount, OMS)
4        Jeff Perren        (Viscount, OMS, Mercenary Captain, OH)
5        Christopher Schleicher        (Chief Scrivner, Viscount)
6        Terry Kuntz        (Chamberlain, Baron, OMS)
7        Dave Arneson        (Pursuivant, Baron)
8        Russell Tulp        (Justicar, Baron)
9        Rick Crane        (High Constable, Baron, OH)
10        Ken Scher        (Baron)
11        Stephen A. Thomas Jr.        (Baron)
12        Stefen Kwiatkowski        (Baron, OH)
13        Tom Webster        (OMS)
14        Harry Manogg        (Herald, Kt.)
15        H. Axel Krigsman Jr.        (Sheriff, Kt.)
16        Al Macintyre        (Kt.)
17        Chris Johnson        (Court Jester, Kt.)
18        Read Boles        (Kt.)
19        Bill Hoyer        (Kt.)
20        Paul Cote        (Esq.)
21        Richard Locke        (Esq.)
22        Sam Ferris        (Esq.)
23        Duane Jenkins        (Esq.)
24        Terry Stafford        (Esq.)
25        Patrick Wilson        (Gent.)
26        Bill Larson        (Gent.)
27        John Bobek        (Gent.)
28        George Kwiatkowski        (Gent.)
29        Gerald Crane        (Gent.)
30        Steve Umstead        (Gent.)
31        Terry Winckler        (Gent.)
32        Stuart Trembly        (Gent.)
33        Tom Bray        (Gent.)
34        Len Lakofka        (Gent.)
35        Charles Pasco        (Gent.)
36        Tom Hazlett        (Gent.)
37        Harley Anton        (Gent.)
38        James Lurvey        (Gent.)
39        Bill Belke        (Gent.)
40        George Patton        (Gent.)
41        Mike Gutierrez        (Gent.)

  

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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:32 pm 
 

Articles of Notable Influence on the Future of the Hobby


Foundations of Chainmail:

Domesday #5 (7/70): LGTSA Miniatures Rules, by Jeff Perren with Gary Gygax
Domesday #6 (8/70: Burnaby Medieval Rules (B.C. Chapter, Model Generals' Club)
Domesday #7 (9/70): Whose Rules are These?, by Gary Gygax (medieval miniatures)
Domesday #11 (1971): LGTSA Medieval Miniatures: Rules Changes, by Gary Gygax

Prelude to OD&D Blackmoor:

Domesday #13 (7/72): Facts about Black Moor, by Dave Arneson (with map of the vicinity)

Prelude to AD&D Oriental Adventures:

Domesday #6 (8/70): Medieval Japan, by Gary Gygax

  

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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:33 pm 
 

Neat work, Frank.
Where do I need to raid to read nos. 5 through 7. Those look intriguing! :)

  

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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:34 pm 
 

Hah! Took the words out of my mouth, with that last post! :D

  

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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:41 pm 
 

Amazingly, I actually have a spare original of #7...

one corner of the cover slightly torn.
email me a ridiculously high offer and I might accept. ;>

  

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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:50 pm 
 

I bid Mount Everest.

*looks around*. Beat that if ya can... :P

  


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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:04 pm 
 

I bid Olympus Mons.

  

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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:07 pm 
 

Um, let's keep this board for Domesday pls?

(Edit: See Classifieds post, private sale; keep it offa heah!)

Anybody got info on #1-4 or #9?

  


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Post Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:44 pm 
 

Howdy Frank,


As requested:

#4 Jun 1970       
Society Rank and Privelege        Gary Gygax
Armorial Bearings (Kuntz, Gygax, Perren, Jenkins)        Gary Gygax
Battle Report - Two Groves        Gary Gygax
Medieval Arms (excerpts from Encyclopedia Britannica)        Gary Gygax
DB Trivia Contest Answers (I, II, III, IV)        Gary Gygax
DB Trivia Contest V        Rob Kuntz
Jousting! (Preview of Jousting Article and PBM Tournnament)        Gary Gygax
Painting Tip        Read Boles
Japanese Armory        Gary Gygax and Rob Kuntz
Membership List and Precedence        Gary Gygax
Suggested Name for this Society and It's Newsletter        Gary Gygax
The Broadside (Letters)        Chris Johnson and Gary Gygax

I'll have to dig out #9.


Futures Bright,

Paul


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Post Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 1:53 am 
 

Some of us don't know the history of the Domesday Book (or at least the American gaming version).  Could you give us some background?

Mark   :?


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Post Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 10:38 am 
 

http://www.acaeum.com/Library/Domesday.html


Allan Grohe ([email protected])
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https://www.facebook.com/BlackBladePublishing/

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Post Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 10:45 am 
 

Sounds like the current round of information is cruicial and ought to be added to the Acaeum's website immediately.  Scans of the known copies should also be added to the site...at least a far as legal and practical.


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Post Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 11:35 am 
 

Current listing doesn't say much, that's for sure.

I have posted about what *I* feel are the notable historical parts of Domesday as regards the birth of Chainmail (and thus Roleplaying and thus Magic the Gathering and several $billion in computer games etc etc). I hope to receive photocopies of #4 and #9 from Paul Stormberg, and also hope to compile a general reference to the whole series. Indeed, I may own some of the only remaining copies in existence, so the burden of historical record must fall on me. ::sigh::

<*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*><*>

Here is a picture of the problems that led to the fall of the Castle & Crusade Society, according to Rob Kuntz. Verbatim and complete; all typos are Rob's.

from Domesday Book, Issue 13: July 1972 (the last issue published)
(by Rob Kuntz, Editor/Publisher)

Notice to the Membership (page 11)

This is in part a reply to Mr. Hoegfeldts letter and some facts about what has been happening to the Society and is going to happen.

Roughly 2 years ago, Gary Gygax and myself decided to form a Society dealing with Medievilism. I was was all for it and Gary had worked out some plans for advertising to get the idea spread around. A little later issues #1 and #2 came out, free of charge. These were meant to stimulate interest and to provide a basis for the formation of a larger newsletter. People who received #2 were told that this was to be the last free issue, and subscription rates would soon follow. A modest sum was offered, $2.00 for IFW members, $3.00 non-IFW. (IFW sponsered the society and advertised it in the Messenger, which is why the special rates were offered to IFW members and still are.) Numbers 3, 4, 5 soon followed to paid members, and the Society seemed to on it's way. But, as life would have it, something just had to happen. Gary Gygax, beforehand, had access to a machine that produced photo-offset. Now, he had not, for reasons not pertaining to this notice. Since we had no funds to buy a mimeograph or the like, the next best thing was to find somebody capable of producing a magazine for the membership, which had now risen to 31.

We found Chris Schleicher, the editor of a diplomacy 'zine named Atlantis. A short while afterwards #6 soon appeared. After that the irregularity started. We tried desperately to get Chris back to one magazine a month status. That failed so we looked around for a new editor, none were to be found. One member summed the whole mess up. "When Schleicher prints the magazine the society continues, when he doesn't…"

About one year and 4 DB's later Gygax said goodbye and dropped out. All but the very confident of the members lost interest in the whole works. Looking back and asking why Chris did not publish the 'zine regularly is a very difficult question. He said that there were no articles coming in. This may have been true and in which case the fault would lay with the membership. But, no ties or bonds were layed upon the members for the articles only polite requests for them. Still none were forthcoming and the C&C was drifting into utter stagnation.

In March of this year I decided to try and put the C&C together once more. Chris was told that his services were no longer required. I at once ordered a mimeograph. My brother hand typed 80 postcards and sent them to the membership, of which you all know about. 25 of the 80 cards sent out were replied to. This discouraged both my brother and I but we kept up. Along with about 40 of the cards a request for articles was given, two people answered.

The mimeo finally arrived after being delayed for 20 days, and we had a few articles. These articles though were not enough for a regular sized DB. So we waited sure that all our requests for material could not go unheeded. But they did, except for the same two persons which kept on sending the stuff in. Feeling that we could wait no longer we hurriedly assembled #12. About July DB #12 was out to all members. Immediately I received some of the questionaires and comments on the issue. Most of the people that wrote to me seemed to be in agreement that the DB was not at all up to its usually higher standards. This I am in full agreement with. But here are the reasons why it was not:

1) The mimeograph itself isn't the greatest in the world. Infact it was the cheapest on I could buy from Sears.
2) Articles, as mentioned berfore, were hard to come by. This made the issue very short. Out of the three, this was the greater problem and still is.
3) This happened to be my first try at publishing a magazine. There are going to be problems when this case arises.

-- cont'd next page
(page 12)

This should give you some idea of what the society has to go through in order to get an issue of DB published and try to satisfy nearly 80 people. Still some very important business has to be taken care of before the members can settle down to some fun and fully enjoy this organization.

PROBLEMS TO BE SETTLED:

Articles are definitely needed. How happy I would be to see DOMESDAY BOOK back up to about 20 pages an issue. This can be accomplished by any number of people interested enough to sit down and start plucking away at the typewriter at what interest them the most. May it be Medievil History, Fantasy, weapons and their uses, ect., you send them in and they're sure to be published. Again, for every 3 pages of typed material sent in one step in rank will be awared to the contributor.

No further back copies of DB's are available. Little of what we had have been exhausted. For those who have issues still coming, will either receive further issues of DB or they may also demand a refund for those issues not recieved.

As I said before most of the membership did not reply to the card requesting the number of issues they had coming yet. This has caused great confusion in the societys records and this problem, if the members want a well operated club, should be rectified. All you have to do is to skim through your DB's and report to us the number you have not received. Simple as that. This will help the club immensely and set it on the right track. It takes a little time and a six cent stamp.

Thank you,
King Robert Kuntz I

  

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Post Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 11:40 am 
 

SO, if we're true Completists  :wink:  we also need, in addition to issues 1-3 (assuming 4 & 9 are forthcoming from Paul):

Those issues of the IFW 'zine The Messenger which contain ads for the Castle & Crusade society (circa 1969-71); and

Any one of the referenced postcards sent to members in the last appeal mentioned in issue 13.

  

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Post Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 2:27 pm 
 

We don't want fake copies of the Domesday Book sold on Ebay, but copies of the extant newsletters should be made for preservation purposes.


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Post Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:23 pm 
 

MShipley88 wrote:We don't want fake copies of the Domesday Book sold on Ebay, but copies of the extant newsletters should be made for preservation purposes.


I think fake copies are less likely to slip out if the photo copies that are distrubted are modified slightly for each person who recieves one.  For example, line and page breaks could occur in slightly different locations in the text on each copy.  Of course this would render some types of research impossible, but so would a non-modified photo copy so its probably not a big issue.

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Post Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:36 pm 
 

If all we had was a complete list of names of subscribers, that would be invaluable.

  It would be interesting to know something about each member of the Castle and Crusade Society.....sort of like a Signers of the Declaration of Independence study.

   Imagine what these retired wardogs must have in their closets...forgotten for 30 years!


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