Interesting Items Previously on eBay
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Post Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2004 7:42 pm 
 

Deadlord36 wrote:Prepub looks like a fake.


With pre-publication material, how can one be totally sure that it's not a fake? Even an autograph could be faked. If the seller comes up with all the other material he promises, chances are that his story is true. The story is weird, sure, but seems consistent otherwise. If this prepub is authentic, it's certainly one of the most fascinating discoveries of AD&D material over the last years. If it's a fake ... well, who's gonna take the risk? Any bets on the outcome yet? I think, it might break the $1.000 mark.


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Post Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 1:31 am 
 

Ummm, yeah, he slipped his copy into a filing cabinet and left it there. And, according to him, it's been "packaged tightly" to account for the new smell..... by Kinko's?
Too fishy for me. I don't get much into prepubs anyways.
Stormie, are you in for this one?


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Post Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 10:54 am 
 

Howdy,


Deadlord36 wrote:Ummm, yeah, he slipped his copy into a filing cabinet and left it there. And, according to him, it's been "packaged tightly" to account for the new smell..... by Kinko's?
Too fishy for me. I don't get much into prepubs anyways.
Stormie, are you in for this one?


Hey now! I've been bitten once already this month... April Fools are no fun...


Futures Bright,

Paul


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Post Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 12:25 pm 
 

I have no idea if it's authentic but the guy has run up a decent score on his feedback (324) with no negatives... It would seem to me that amount of work and time would preclude someone from faking ON PURPOSE.  Not to say he might have been duped years ago and innocently carries on the dupe.

Or it's legit... or is a legitimate 'pirated copy' from the days of yore when getting something photocopied WAS pirating it and perhaps was the best way to get the item distributed for a legitimate con.

The real question is in content.  Are there any differences in this copy vs the 'Known' R-1/RPGA-1?

Arrrgh... Confound Ebayers and their incomplete descriptions!


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Post Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 2:49 pm 
 

R2: THE INVESTIGATION OF HYDELL - - SHRINK-WRAP, MINT
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 3187206462
10 days with no reserve.  Current bid is $43.00.  Same seller as the "To the Aid of Falx" modules (kdkdkd).  States he will be posting more rare stuff.

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Post Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 5:01 pm 
 

Just email him...  he's quite pleasant, and I'm inclined to think that he's legit.  He was quite active on the RPGA scene in the early years.

  

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Post Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 5:30 pm 
 

"Also, my module mentions that this was used at GenCon South in February 1981 but, unlike their copy, makes no mention of it ALSO then being used at GenCon East in July 1981. These two things make it appear that my module is an earlier version of the one shown on the Acaeum site."

SO let me get this straight. He served as head gamemaster at Muscacon I, and they sent him a copy which says GenCon South. GenCon South was in February. Muscacon would have had to be in January at best, in order for the GC South info to be there. Also, why would they send it to playtest at a con when it had already been used at South?
Fishy...........


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 3:48 am 
 

If you've ever had to deal w/ RPGA before, they can be complete tightwads when it comes to money (they have to be...  they are ALWAYS underfunded by TSR/WotC).  I'm guessing that this is a spare copy they threw his way rather than whip up a totally new one.  It could be something like a "draft" that got accidentally sent out.
It's also been what, 13 or so years?  He could be getting his Cons mixed up.  Like I said, have you emailed the guy and said "I think you are a fraud, prove me otherwise or the gig is up."?
Also, from my research, quite a few Con modules got alot of play elsewhere from where they first premiered...  look at the current RPGA module schedules, its why they usually use the term "first run" now to denote a premier.
If I had any money, I'd bet that this puppy is legit.

  

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Post Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 10:19 am 
 

This is just a Tourney copy. It isn't a Pre-Pub. He is just being a little misleading using the term "Pre-Pub", although it was produced prior to the published version.

  

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Post Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 12:09 pm 
 

Hmmm. If it is "just a tourney copy", then I imagine it is rarer than an actual numbered pre-pub, and worth more.


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 1:11 pm 
 

Deadlord36 wrote:Hmmm. If it is "just a tourney copy", then I imagine it is rarer than an actual numbered pre-pub, and worth more.


I would disagree with that assessment.  It looks like the copy being offered currently is, in fact, a duplicate of an "official pre-pub" based on the condition.  Since there is no way to verify its authenticity it's no better than a copy produced by anyone else for use in a convention.  The only value it really has is that it is a copy of a rare item, which is still very difficult to come by, and it does have some "provenance", or history to back it up.  I would be hesitant to throw too much money at such an item...

  


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 2:55 pm 
 

burntwire wrote:This is just a Tourney copy. It isn't a Pre-Pub. He is just being a little misleading using the term "Pre-Pub", although it was produced prior to the published version.


Wait a second, I get a little confused here. If this is not a pre-pub version, why do we call the R1, R2 and R3 "pre-publication"? Page Not Found

Weren't they used in these tournaments? Or were they just sold during the tournaments, but not actually used?


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Post Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 8:44 pm 
 

Ralf Toth wrote:
burntwire wrote:This is just a Tourney copy. It isn't a Pre-Pub. He is just being a little misleading using the term "Pre-Pub", although it was produced prior to the published version.


Wait a second, I get a little confused here. If this is not a pre-pub version, why do we call the R1, R2 and R3 "pre-publication"? Page Not Found

Weren't they used in these tournaments? Or were they just sold during the tournaments, but not actually used?


There are two different versions of R1-R3 & only one of R4.  The official pre-pubs R-1 thru R-3 and the RPGA published versions R1-R4.  These are described in detail at the link you provided.  The one being discussed here appears to be a copy of one of the "official" pre-pubs that was used in the "Muscacon" Tourney.  Bottom line, without a number and a signature it's not one of the official pre-pubs that are described at the Acaeum and not worth much more than any other Tourney copy.  Of course we will see...  Unless the seller can verify the authenticity it's just a copy that anyone could make.  This whole topic does call into question the high values associated with items like the pre-pubs which can be forged fairly easily.  That's why provenance, or traceable history, is so important.  It's the only way to assure the authenticity of an item such as this.

  

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Post Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 12:39 am 
 

For what it's worth -- and I haven't been contacted by the seller, or anyone else, to attempt to verify the module, so I'm only going off the information on the auction page -- this is a tough call.

The biggest points for this being a genuine article are:

A) Seller has a very good, extensive feedback rating.  He could be deciding to "cash out" on one big scam here, but not very likely.

B) The module is not an identical photocopy of a pre-pub.  Anyone who was going to create a fake, or even just photocopy a genuine module, would at least get the cover page correct.

Without knowing more about it, or seeing some detailed scans, my feeling is that the module is exactly what the seller says it is.  It was given to him from a source at the RPGA, to be run as a tournament adventure at "Muscacon".  It is a pre-publication version of the pre-publication.

Now, the issue of how much it's worth is a completely different story.  It is probably a generic photocopy, and obviously has neither an original signature nor a serial number (the two things which make the pre-pub R modules collectible, and verifiable).  It would be, in fact, identical to R7-10 Dwarven Quest, which is just a photocopy.  How much would you pay for R7-10?  Or even better, how much would you pay for a genuine original D&D manuscript, which itself was just a photocopy?

A very difficult question.  If you could prove the photocopy was made in 1974... but then, we start to degenerate into silliness.

Bottom line: caveat emptor.  Buyer beware.  I believe this item is a genuine article, but it's value to the collecting community is highly subjective.  As a interesting piece of trivia, certainly, but as a centerpiece of your collection -- not so sure.

And you can be damn certain that the second module like this to surface will be met with a healthy dose of skepticism that it was run off last week at Kinko's.  :(

Foul

P.S.  Frank Mentzer would be a good source to contact about the existence of this, btw.

  


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Post Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 5:05 am 
 

So, R1-R3 in  their "pre-publication" form are basically tournament modules, right or wrong? In contrast to other tournament modules, they were signed by Mentzer and they were released as official RPGA modules later. Is that correct?

I'm just trying to grasp the full meaning of "pre-publication". Here is how I understand it: It is a version of the module which was later released officially. It was released in a number greater than one (else it would be the manuscript). It seems, the "pre-pubs" shown at the Acaeum are all numbered and signed. Is this a criteria for "pre-pub"?

In essence, I'd like to know, what is the big difference between the "pre-publication" versions of R1-R3 and any other official tournament (e.g. GenCon) module that explains their extremely high value? Is it only because R1-R3 were later released officially? Is it because of Mentzers autograph? Is it because they were sold at the convention through the hands of TSR employees? Or are all tournament copies worth around $800? (If so, some people have made fine bargains on eBay over the last years ...)


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Post Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 8:16 am 
 

AD&D R1 To The Aid Of Falx RPGA OOP! RARE!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 09504&rd=1
7 days with no reserve.  Current bid is $9.99.



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Post Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 8:22 am 
 

TSR 8004 Old Style D&D Dragon Dice Percentile Generator
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 43357&rd=1
7 days with no reserve.  Opening bid is $4.00.  In original package.

TSR 8005 Old D&D Dragon Dice Polyhedral Number Generato
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 43212&rd=1
7 days with no reserve.  Opening bid is $4.00.  In original package.



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Post Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 10:40 am 
 

Good assessment, Scott, except for one thing. This is a POST-pre-pub. Since it mentions being used at the other Cons, it had to have come out AFTER the Cons.


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