Shady Dealers
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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 3:47 am 
 

Why would anyone drop money on stock photos? Especially above $10? Surely you have to question why the seller is not going to tell you the thruth about the condition of the item and post a photo? And if you make that link, you must already be questioning thier honesty before you place a bid.

Seller's account had only been operating for 28 days, prior to being dormant for five years having received negative feedback for fraud, stealing and non delivery?! Why risk it?

If I can't see what I'm buying and the seller won't actually take a photo and show me what I'm buying and just says it's used and it's valuable so give me your money, I wouldn't be gambling my money on it, because sometime when I gamble I lose. Be it to a seller who lied about the condition, or a seller who lied about actually having the goods. It's something that eBay taught me over the years.

Unless you are selling brand new mint condition products and they are relatively new to the market, there is absolutely no excuse for not providing a photo. If you bid on a listing because you think you're getting it cheap by taking risks other people wouldn't take, sometimes you get more hassle that you bargained for.

I trust you bought on a credit card and have your credit card company for security? This is another error some people make. Don't EVER take your dispute to PayPal first if you can take your dispute to your credit card company.

By going to PayPal, you lose your right to claim through your credit card company and have PayPal play ball. If you claim through your credit card company, PayPal automatically take the money off of the seller and leave it for the card company to resolve with the seller's account. If you claim through PayPal and they find in the seller's favour, and then you claim through your credit card, PayPal have already found in favour of their client and you have already agreed to the terms and conditions of their resolution process. You get the funds back from your credit card company, but PayPal then resolve the debt between their insurance and your account, and this can leave your account in debt/ frozen, and they will pursue that debt.

Go to the credit card company first, every single time.

The fake delivery confirmation number works with PayPal, because PayPal only require a number to prove the item was posted. Delivery confirmation does not need to be to the buyer.

I hope this works out for you. Doesn't seem like you got burned for much, but it's hard to swallow nonetheless. Have you left negative feedback yet to warn others?


This week I've been mostly eating . . . chicken and wild rice soup.

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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 5:42 am 
 

mbassoc2003 wrote:By going to PayPal, you lose your right to claim through your credit card company


Ian, you're wrong : if you loose when using Paypal process, you can still open a case near your credit card company and win. The sole differences are :
* the credit card company claim is resolved faster than recoursing to a Paypal claim
* in a credit card company case, the seller pays extra fees to Paypal  :lol:  8)   :twisted:

  

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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 9:00 am 
 

In the UK, if you lose a case through PayPal, PayPal can then offset a credit card chargeback and it's associated fee against your account.

I know about the chargeback fee. In the UK it's £7. I've been on both sides of this. Charged back and then lost my money by PayPal having already found in favour of the seller. And having been charged back by a buyer who claimed an item did not arrive.

If you're a seller and a chargeback happens, if you issue a PayPal refund you then become liable for the chargeback fee because you have admitted liability by issuing a refund.

The only way to guarantee you get your money back is to pay on a credit card and chargeback immediately if the seller is on the take. If you go down any other route, or you are suckered into PayPal's claims system, you pretty much give up all rights to PayPal's decision making machine with no recourse other than an appeal to the saim people. PayPal do have the right to debit money from your PayPal account if they disagree with your chargeback and find in the seller's favour, and if you have a negative balance they can then initiate recovery through a debt collecting agency.

I imagine the rules and how they are implemented vary from country to country, and even state to state in the US, but I would expect the spirit and mechanic to be similar.


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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:44 am 
 

mbassoc2003 wrote:
I imagine the rules and how they are implemented vary from country to country, and even state to state in the US, but I would expect the spirit and mechanic to be similar.


Ian it is different in the US, you can chargeback to a credit card anytime within three months or so regardless of the circumstances.

Mike B.


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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:50 am 
 

In the UK you can chargeback anytime within the credit card issuers terms (usually six months), but PayPal have a caneat that says they have the right to investigate and find in the other party's favour, and that if you agree to their terms and conditions, you accept this term. It means they can charge your account if you initiate a chargeback and they don't agree with it. I was just pointing out that them making such a decision is far more likely if they have already found against you, whereas if you go directly to your credit card in the first instance, they tend to default to just processing the refund in your favour without their own investigation.


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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 11:15 am 
 

Well I have used the Paypal process far to often and it has always decided in my favour and refund my cash.  Since I never got the item I am pretty confident I will get the dough back.


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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 11:49 am 
 

We're all hoping for a good outcome here.

Feeding PayPal a delivery confirmation number that is either bogus or for another package is a common trick that PayPal accept too many times. We even heard that Troll & Toad use this to avoid paying out and covering their backs when they don't ship stuff. So when the big companies begin adopting the tricks of the scamsters, you can tell there's a major flaw in PayPal's processes.

I think in the US there is too much of the 'let them sort it out between themselves in court' kind of attitude. We see PayPal and eBay disputes that should be sorted out by PayPal on Court TV too often to assume the companies get it right mostly. I imagine PayPal can just say, "We'll give the money to this guy, and if that guy has an issue, let them sue eachother."

At least it's no biggie, and hope all comes good in your favour, but it's funny how the other expensive items he sold also mysteriously never arrived and he only had stock art for them too.

The guy seems to be scamming people, and I imagine the scale of the scam will become apparent over the coming months.


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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 3:40 pm 
 

Blackmoor wrote:Well I have used the Paypal process far to often and it has always decided in my favour and refund my cash.  Since I never got the item I am pretty confident I will get the dough back.


So far it's worked for me as well.  *crosses fingers*  I hope this settlement works out for you.  8)


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Post Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 11:33 pm 
 

Here in France i have a good advantage concerning national deals : as i am a Postal Main Officer i have sweared to always tell the truth and in the past each time i sent a copy of my Postal Main officer badge to Paypal they always have taken their decision in my favor, even when i provide no tracking # to my buyers ; it is the same for a friend who is a policeman.
Let it be !

  

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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:33 am 
 

Blackmoor wrote:sigh............. ripped off again, no communication and no item


** expired eBay auction **


Didn't somebody say this guy was another incarnation of JonB :?

Anyway paypal claim started, I hope it turnms out well




Got the dough back today, the fake tracking number did not work :)


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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 3:27 am 
 

Blackmoor wrote:Got the dough back today, the fake tracking number did not work :)

Glad it all worked out.
It's just a shame T&T couldn't be honest and tell the truth.
Anyone from T&T care to comment?


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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 12:27 pm 
 

mbassoc2003 wrote:Glad it all worked out.
It's just a shame T&T couldn't be honest and tell the truth.
Anyone from T&T care to comment?


What does Blackmoors transaction with the jamiepressly guy have to do with T&T?

I used to hesitate to buy from T&T but saw an item at a great price and decided to see what would happen. Since then I have ordered from Troll & Toad a dozen times or more and the service, packing and shipping time has been fantastic.


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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 12:43 pm 
 

JasonZavoda wrote:
What does Blackmoors transaction with the jamiepressly guy have to do with T&T?


It was mentioned in the T&T thread that they have also used fake tracking numbers, I think thats the similarity.


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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 12:54 pm 
 

8O  My bad!
So there are two guys with two seperate transactions, both with fake tracking numbers and PayPal disputes? One with T&T and one with someone else?

Here was me hoping the one with T&T had been resolved and the guy had got his stuff or his money back? Is that one still open? Or did the guy get his money back? Last I read, T&T had admitted they had given false information to PayPal to win the case, but that they had mailed his order to another person and had not mailed him anything.

And here was me thinking T&T had eventually sorted out a bad transaction? That's a damn shame for that guy.

Good news for Blackmoor, anyways, and I'm glad PayPal eventually relented after the fake delivery information thing.

I've only dealt with T&T a few times, and in both instances their communication was incompetent and rude. One purchase went bad because they agreed to combine shipping beforehand, but then refused to combine shipping after I'd purchased, and the other two deals both turned out to be in a lot worse condition than they described, one item being both damaged and incomplete. They refused to agree a refund, requiring that I mail the items back to the US, so I ended up charging back my CC. Their staff are some of the most ignorant and incompetent call handlers I've ever spoken to. You'd get better service and more intelligent use of the english language calling India or the Philipines. How they educate people in their little part of America really needs to be looked at. But as T&T have said, there really is only the locals they can employ, and they have no choice.

I do get what you say about T&T. I've bought doznes of times from Cougie, sold to him, traded with him, and talked to him on the phone. Never had a single problem and never been screwed on postage.

It seems to be a case that people don't sh!t in their own backyards. T&T seem to have issues with Canadian customers more than any other group, but of course that's just the impressing given by people posting on forums. On the same note, most of Cougie's deals that go bad seem to be with Americans.

Aside... What happended to our French scientist postal officer secret agent who'd sworn an oath to always tell the truth? Did he get banned?


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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 1:18 pm 
 

mbassoc2003 wrote:8O  My bad!
So there are two guys with two seperate transactions, both with fake tracking numbers and PayPal disputes? One with T&T and one with someone else?

Aside... What happended to our French scientist postal officer secret agent who'd sworn an oath to always tell the truth? Did he get banned?


The T&T case is in their thread and just haven't returned items that were wrongly included in a sale to them and now they've denied receiving them.

As for the mad scientist, lurker_above has been banned looking at his profile but according to him, he could come back again whenever he wants as he is a computer genius too.  :roll:  :lol:


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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 1:27 pm 
 

JasonZavoda wrote:I used to hesitate to buy from T&T but saw an item at a great price and decided to see what would happen. Since then I have ordered from Troll & Toad a dozen times or more and the service, packing and shipping time has been fantastic.


:roll: sigh.   Another T&T fan boy.

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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 1:40 pm 
 

lurker_above admitted he was guydrin_avalon in a separate post and was banned again.


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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:44 pm 
 

ashmire13 wrote:
The T&T case is in their thread and just haven't returned items that were wrongly included in a sale to them and now they've denied receiving them.

As for the mad scientist, lurker_above has been banned looking at his profile but according to him, he could come back again whenever he wants as he is a computer genius too.  :roll:  :lol:

The guy who said T&T's call handler refused to give her name, was the guy who said T&T had faked delivery information to PayPal in order to win the case, and he was going to PayPal on appeal because USPS had confirmed that the delivery confirmation was bogus, and subsequent to that, T&T arse and T&T elbow weren't communicationg and someone from T&T fessed up to him that they hadn't mailed him his package and would send it to him, and that the delivery confirmation was a mistake.

So what did the mad-scientist super-postal genius do that means he's banned?


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Post Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:53 pm 
 

argyrebasin wrote:lurker_above admitted he was guydrin_avalon in a separate post and was banned again.

I believe the original offense was assclownery.  That, and stating that it would be pointless to ban him because he could easily register again.

Foul

  


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Post Posted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:15 am 
 

Wow...how interesting - I have just seen the last post on here as I was about to post a comment about my first negative feedback received on e-bay.

Just to open - I'm not a professional seller - I'm clearing out old stuff and find Acaeum a fascinating and useful resource for pricing. I don't know whether some of the guys who bought my RPGA rares for big $$ last year use this site but I got rid of them first (all the buyers seemed very happy) and so am now clearing out 'the rest'.

Well....I sold a Near Mint B6 to this French buyer, about £12 I think, so not megabucks. I packed it as well as I could in a jiffy bag, tightly cornered with masking tape and wrote 'DO NOT BEND' in French & English but I didn't even think to put cardboard in there (I haven't done this with the UK shipments I have made in this auction) - I paid £2.19 for an item which actually cost £2.25 to post and would only normally put cardboard in if (i) it was mega bucks and/or the buyer requested it (as one of the rares buyers did last year) and I could quote with that included.

Anyway...today I get my first big red blob on e-bay with this charming feedback (the buyer hadn't contacted me to register his disappointment or ask me to take any action):

"Would-be "near mint" within a jiffy bag => bent VGC at arrival ! NASTY GUY AVOID"

Accompanied by the following more personal e-mail:

"That is what you will earn each time you sent a near mint module within a jiffy bag, without AT LEAST a cardboard within !!!

You're a stupid seller unable to pack items with efficiency."

- guydrin_avalon

Needless to say, I wasn't best pleased so told him that given he hadn't contacted me about this in advance but had left me just 'bad-mouthing' feedback, any apology or discussion of refund on my part was just not going to happen.

So I got this in return:

"Your very high shipping charges concerning other items for sale demonstrates by themselves that you're a ripp off seller !
You're unable to understand how to pack items with efficiency for them to arrive in the same condition they were sent. Writing "do not bend" is clearly not enough, as delivery is automatized for at least 95% of the trip !!!
Given your PATHETIC reaction, i have no other choice instead of going to my bank office tomorrow on the morning for a credit card chargeback, with the item and its picture as proof it is not the item i bet for !
YOU are the idiot, and will stay idiot when my bank office will chargeback my payment and Paypal will have no other choice instead of refunding me because MY BANK OFFICE WILL TAKE DECISION ON MY SIDE and Paypal will also charge you +£6 as chargeback fees ABOVE item price + Shipping !!

See you tomorrow for chargeback, immature guy, as i don't need your nor paypal to recover my funds !
If you were kind, i would have revised my feedback !"

Such charisma :) Interesting comments, especially as I have actually refunded two previous buyers (out of the very small number I have ever sold to) some money because the actual postage was cheaper than I thought.

But it looks from the above that this guy is known to Acaeum? Was it a mistake dealing with him? Am I totally in the wrong by not putting cardboard in all of my sales?!??

Would appreciate any advice please - is it true that I can be charged back and lose the item? Wow, if that is the case then this lot of e-bay listings will certainly be my last. Anything I can do to stop this?

Jeez...such hassle for getting rid of a few books.

Thanks in advance.

  
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