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Post Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:45 pm 
 

serleran wrote:That is 2nd edition Player's Options: Skills and Powers stuff.

That's what I thought, too. I'm not seeing any feats or other 3e identifiers that should be jumping out at me. The armor class is also wrong for that edition.

Looks like this attempt to mock 3e fell pretty flat; that's a 2e character ... seriously, if we're going to beat this dead horse, can we at least get the basic facts right?  :?

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Post Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:36 pm 
 

Kingofpain89 wrote:
You realize that this PC description was probably written by either a 7 year old girl or a really screwed up 15 year old boy right?  So you guys are either making fun of a sweet, imaginative little girl who loves unicorns and just finished watching the Dragonlance movie, or a pathetic, retarded wretch of a teenage boy who lives most of his day drooling on himself and whacked out of his gourd from the anti-psychotics he takes.  Either way...you guys are just big 'ol meanies.

By the way....what the hell is a "life death quest"?  :P


Well you see there is life...and um, death....and uh, a quest involved.....something like that???? :D

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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 9:57 am 
 

Kingofpain89 wrote:
You realize that this PC description was probably written by either a 7 year old girl or a really screwed up 15 year old boy right?  So you guys are either making fun of a sweet, imaginative little girl who loves unicorns and just finished watching the Dragonlance movie, or a pathetic, retarded wretch of a teenage boy who lives most of his day drooling on himself and whacked out of his gourd from the anti-psychotics he takes.  Either way...you guys are just big 'ol meanies.

By the way....what the hell is a "life death quest"?  :P


I have little doubt that the PC was likely created by one of the two children that you mentioned. However, there is still the little problem of WHO helped that child create the PC. (The DM?).

If it was a 7 year old girl, then there had to be someone older to help her with the few rules they did use. :roll:

If it was a teenage boy's PC/NPC, then well............ yup BIG problems.

In either case, how the hell did such a thing get past whatever editiing was done for the PRG web sites NPC netbook?

Any simple word processing program would have weeded out the spelling errors and some of the grammatical errors.

BTW: I also have no clue what the life death quest is all about.
Unless it is a life quest wherein the PC figures it will mean her death to complete. A life long quest to the death.

Yes 2nd edition with special skills and awesome powers and of course elevated stats.


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:32 am 
 

Aneoth wrote:In either case, how the hell did such a thing get past whatever editiing was done for the PRG web sites NPC netbook?

Any simple word processing program would have weeded out the spelling errors and some of the grammatical errors.


Hmmm....maybe it was one of the Whitfield kids that wrote it?  Bad spelling, bad grammar, and a sick, twisted love of a specific female Dragonlance character.  It all adds up!  :twisted:

It really is sad that so many parents nowadays are passing down more and more of their faults and failings to their offspring.  Speaking of bad parenting....did everyone hear about this?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23905909/?GT1=43001

How pathetic do you have to be as a parent that your 8, 9, or ten year old child organizes a plot to kill his or her teacher because the teacher scolded him for acting up in class?  Crap like this keeps up and they are going to start having to put security guards and metal detectors at pre-schools.  If you ask me, this is what happens when people dont spank their kids and dont allow the schools to do so either.  Hell, when I acted like a dumbass in grade school I got sent to the principal and got my ass whipped.  Then I got my ass whipped again when I got home.  Did I do it again?  Hell no!  Now they send kids to In-School Suspension where they sit and do nothing or screw around with other delinquents.  Whoop-dee-frickin'-do.  I say send 'em down to the coaches and make them run laps 'til they puke.  If they talk back or dont do it, then give them a good whack across the ass.  If parents would just let the teachers do their jobs instead of butting their noses in and denying them the ability to discipline the students, I think there would be a lot less of this crap going on.  If kids learn early on that they can pretty much get away with anything, it is just going to embolden them to do whatever the heck they want.

And people wonder why my wife and I arent having kids.  :?


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:51 am 
 

I agree, King. We coddle our kids and then wonder why they can't function in society as kids OR as adults.
Mine is homeschooled, so I don't worry about guns, drugs, bad language, and all that. I would work three jobs if necessary to prevent exposing him to the ridiculous school environments out there. Once he gets old enough to be able to make solid choices and decisions, it may be a different story. Then again, I can give him this:

14-x+2=8

and tell him to solve for x, and he does it. He knows all of the States and their capitals, all the planets and their moons, and all of the differences between reptiles, mammals, birds and insects. Pretty good for a 6 1/2 year old.
I would guess the Lauranna character was a kid's. The stats are obviously over the top, but the character I use with my son is pretty top-heavy too. It helps to ensure survival; with very young players, it is better to be fairly lax on the rules. They don't take character death quite as well as we do.


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:57 am 
 

Kingofpain89 wrote:
Hmmm....maybe it was one of the Whitfield kids that wrote it?  Bad spelling, bad grammar, and a sick, twisted love of a specific female Dragonlance character.  It all adds up!  :twisted:

It really is sad that so many parents nowadays are passing down more and more of their faults and failings to their offspring.  Speaking of bad parenting....did everyone hear about this?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23905909/?GT1=43001

How pathetic do you have to be as a parent that your 8, 9, or ten year old child organizes a plot to kill his or her teacher because the teacher scolded him for acting up in class?  Crap like this keeps up and they are going to start having to put security guards and metal detectors at pre-schools.  If you ask me, this is what happens when people dont spank their kids and dont allow the schools to do so either.  Hell, when I acted like a dumbass in grade school I got sent to the principal and got my ass whipped.  Then I got my ass whipped again when I got home.  Did I do it again?  Hell no!  Now they send kids to In-School Suspension where they sit and do nothing or screw around with other delinquents.  Whoop-dee-frickin'-do.  I say send 'em down to the coaches and make them run laps 'til they puke.  If they talk back or dont do it, then give them a good whack across the ass.  If parents would just let the teachers do their jobs instead of butting their noses in and denying them the ability to discipline the students, I think there would be a lot less of this crap going on.  If kids learn early on that they can pretty much get away with anything, it is just going to embolden them to do whatever the heck they want.

And people wonder why my wife and I arent having kids.  :?


The more I read that story and thought about it, the more it seemed like the kids had a total disconnect between what they planned and what actually would happen once the knife and crystal paperweight and duct tape came out.  Probably have been watching cable tv and playing violent video games for half their short life, and didn't actually think anyone would get hurt...I mean, just hit the rewind/restart button, right?  At least that's what people will say when looking for excuses. And the excuses will beging soon. I wish Mark Shipley would post about this because being a teacher I bet he has an opinion on this or some stories that would knock your socks off!

I honestly think you'd be surprised if you met some of the parents..out of nine kids, I bet at least a few did everything "right".  No telling what kids will do when A. They don't think it's "real"; B. They don't think ahead to factor in consequences; and C. Their friends are egging them on telling them it's "cool".  I know some people I grew up with and their parents did all the right things.....only to have them turn out to be total asses.  And some of the best people I know had worthless parents or their parents ditched them.  It all comes down to personal responsibility, which we have neglected enforcing for years in our society....it's always someone elses fault.  But when it comes right down to it, sometimes people make choices.  There are other kids in the class that didn't elect to participate, so it's not like everyone made a bad choice here.

BTW in the vein of making excuses, my mothers father (grandfather) came from a dirt poor Louisana home in the early part of the last century.  Seven brothers and sisters with an alcoholic mom and a worthless, deadbeat dad that not only didn't feed the family, he gambled the money away, and when in town would come over and beat the crap out of all the kids so bad he would be thrown in prison today if he tried it. Yet, oddly, my grandfather and his six siblings grew up to not only shun liquor, but according to my mom not a single one ever spanked their kids (mom never got spanked her entire life...by her father...her mother was a different story!!!)   They, my grandfather and siblings,  had every "excuse" in the world to grow up assholes and inflict pain and suffering on others, and not one of them did.   Today a boatload of psychologists, psychiatrists, and therapists would be excusing them whatever awful behavior they had as a result of their terrible upbringing. Thank God that generation didn't have access to Jerry Springer or Dr. Phil. :D

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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:04 am 
 

There are other forms of abuse such as this recent one from Dallas.

http://religionblog.dallasnews.com/arch ... ssibl.html

Her parents didn't seek medical care for her, saying they believe healing comes from God.


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:08 am 
 

jasonw1239 wrote:There are other forms of abuse such as this recent one from Dallas.

http://religionblog.dallasnews.com/arch ... ssibl.html



Actually, not that we don't have lots of freaks here in Dallas, but this story actually took place in Wisconsin...the story was in the DMN, but the events happened in Weston.

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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:26 am 
 

Thanks! I missed that completely. A friend forwarded that link to me and I missed the Wisconsin reference.

We have the same problem around here with extreme fundamentalists. A few years back a local man was charged for practicing medicine without a license after telling some of his followers to stop taking their prescriptions followed by some fatalities. He was billing himself as a faith healer.


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:32 am 
 

jasonw1239 wrote:Thanks! I missed that completely. A friend forwarded that link to me and I missed the Wisconsin reference.

We have the same problem around here with extreme fundamentalists. A few years back a local man was charged for practicing medicine without a license after telling some of his followers to stop taking their prescriptions followed by some fatalities. He was billing himself as a faith healer.


Hell, I had a friend that did that...she called herself a "herbalist"! She had to stop dispensing her "natural remedies" when someone she was "advising" had a heart attack because the herbal remedy she convinced the victim to take was, unlike what she said, NOT as good as the actual heart medicine... 8O

Just lucky a death didn't result....

And my friend is/was a Gaian (sp?).  I guess you can't get more "fundamentalist" than that!  :wink:

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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:42 am 
 

Badmike wrote:
The more I read that story and thought about it, the more it seemed like the kids had a total disconnect between what they planned and what actually would happen once the knife and crystal paperweight and duct tape came out.  Probably have been watching cable tv and playing violent video games for half their short life, and didn't actually think anyone would get hurt...I mean, just hit the rewind/restart button, right?  At least that's what people will say when looking for excuses. And the excuses will beging soon. I wish Mark Shipley would post about this because being a teacher I bet he has an opinion on this or some stories that would knock your socks off!

I honestly think you'd be surprised if you met some of the parents..out of nine kids, I bet at least a few did everything "right".  No telling what kids will do when A. They don't think it's "real"; B. They don't think ahead to factor in consequences; and C. Their friends are egging them on telling them it's "cool".  I know some people I grew up with and their parents did all the right things.....only to have them turn out to be total asses.  And some of the best people I know had worthless parents or their parents ditched them.  It all comes down to personal responsibility, which we have neglected enforcing for years in our society....it's always someone elses fault.  But when it comes right down to it, sometimes people make choices.  There are other kids in the class that didn't elect to participate, so it's not like everyone made a bad choice here.

Mike B.


There are probably way too many variables to deduce exactly what caused those kids to act the way they did.  But reading about the escalation of violence at schools over the past decade and all of the rules that basically tie the hands of the school administrators nowadays, even more is being pushed back on the parents.  From what you see and hear in the news, most parents dont want their children disciplined at school but they dont take any action themselves and so the kids dont face any reprisals from either the school or the parents.

My parents were far from perfect.  My dad was emotionally and physically abusive and my mother tried her best to make sure that my brothers and I turned out ok but she had to work two jobs to make ends meet when my father left.  I was a pretty decent kid...never got into much trouble and made good grades all throughout school.  But I didnt learn discipline and respect from my parents.  I learned that from my teachers.  If I got out of line or caused problems at school, my teacher had every right to discipline me.  And my parents were 100% behind any action that the teacher took as long as the punishment was fair and fit the crime.  IIRC I only disliked one teacher all throughout grade school and high school and that was my Jr. High football and track coach.  And even though I thought he was a complete tool, I still showed him respect and did what he told me to do when I was in his class.

I know a lot of people dont believe in certain types of punishment, but I dont see anything wrong with spanking your kids unless of course it escalates to abusive behavior.  Putting a bit of fear into your kids now and then isnt a bad thing if you ask me.  The best example I have of how corporal punishment seems to work is my two older brothers.  One brother has a son and a daughter (ages 20 and 16) and the other has two sons (age 12 and 9).  My oldest brother with the son and daughter spanked and punished his kids when they broke rules or were disrespectful.  Growing up they respected their parents and other people, they did their chores, and they both have turned out well.  The other brother and his wife dont believe in spanking and most types of punishment.  Their children have always been unruly, disrespectful, and in some cases just plain mean.  And the way they are going will probably act the same as adults.

I know it is not the perfect example but it does show a correlation.  I honestly think that if the latter kids got their asses whipped once in awhile they might actually act like decent human beings.


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:42 am 
 

Lack of responsibility coupled with a lack of common sense. Applies to both the posse kids and the faith healers/murderers. And just about everything else in America.
Here's a great example for you:
Senator Barack Abominable mentioned in a speech the other day that he didn't think his daughters should be "punished" with a child if they make a mistake and get pregnant. This is the most abhorrent type of parenting. it is not punishment is his daughter gets pregnant, it is IRRESPONSIBILITY. 99% of abortions are people not taking responsibility for their actions, plain and simple. I don't care if you're 13 or 45, male or female, if you know HOW to have sex then you know what can happen, and you SHOULD BE responsible for the consequences.


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:08 pm 
 

School officials had alerted police Friday after a pupil tipped off a teacher that a girl had taken a weapon to school.

Tanner said the teacher told detectives the children weren't known as troublemakers.

"You can't dismiss it," Tanner said. "But because they are kids, they may have thought this was like a cartoon — we do whatever and then she stands up and she's OK. That's a hard call."

'We thought they were just kidding'
The purported target teaches third-grade students with learning disabilities, including attention deficit disorder, delayed development and hyperactivity, friends and parents said.


Concerta, Ritalin, Adderall, and other drugs were obviously in the kids systems. They all had some form of ADD, ADHD, or other horrific diseases that had to be treated with DRUGS.

About 15 years ago, I had custody of one of my nephews. He had been mistreated (Abused) by his mother (My sister) and the family took him and his brother from her with permission from CPS.

Anyway, he was enrolled in the local school system and one day he came home with a paper written by his homeroom Teacher and the School Nurse. It stated that he had ADD and had to be treated for it with Ritalin, and that I should take him to a phsych doctor for study. They had tested him for ADD after seeing his lack of ardent attention in class.

I showed up to school the next day and had a meeting with both of them and basically told them all to go to hell. My nephew was NOT going to be phsycho-analyzed and drugged simply to ease their jobs. I told them how it was that I had obtained custody of him and that he was NOT suffering from ADD, but that his lack of attention in class likely had more to do with boredom from a rigid teaching system that had little or no immagination. I did however, admit that some of his problems most assuredly had to do with his previous 6 years with his abusive mother.

The boy (I told them) obviously had a lot to think on, and at 6 years old, what he had to think on was so much more than most kids should ever have on thier minds. I told them to allow me to raise him and to keep thier freeking child rearing opinions and drug em till they behave views and opinions to themselves and to stay OUT of my household.

Later during that schoool year one of his other teachers asked me what ADD drug I had placed him on. She assumed I had done so, since he had made such a drastic turn around from the first time she had seen him.

During the two years that I had him with me, he was a straight A student and NEVER had a single fight.
Amazing, since he had been tested by the school as being ADD and I refused to allow him to be drugged into submission, and I had no clue how to raise kids.
During that time, he never took a single Ritalin pill, or any other of that sort of drug.

He then went to live with one of my other sisters (by family descision) since she had previously taken custody of his older brother two years before and having had three kids of her own, she knew how to raise kids. (I had never had any kids, so obviously I had no clue).

She had him on Ritalin within a week. :roll:

(She got him right before school started)
After the first half year with her, he never made another A in school................ not even in PE.
He had at least a couple of fights each year in school, despite the drugs.
He is an adult now, with no job and no skills.
He recently got a girl pregnant and has no intention of helping her out.
He has little or no future, or at the least it will be a bleaque one.

BTW: Of the 3 kids my experienced sister had given birth to,
Her second oldest daughter went to live with the gilrs dads family at the age of 5. We have never seen her again. Though I heard that she is happy and living a good life.
Her oldest has been in and out of jail since the age of 14 (Now 32 with 3 kids of her own, all by differnet sperm donors).
The youngest, recently gave birth (unwed) at the ripe old age of 14-1/2, beating her own mother by a year there. She has no job and no husband and the sperm donor wants nothing to do with her or the baby. She is now living with her experienced mother to get pointers on how to raise a child with no dad.

Both of the boys (From the abusive sister) that she (the experienced sister) raised by family descision are now adults and neither one has a good outlook for the future. But at least they did not get raised by some dude who had no clue.


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:20 pm 
 

Deadlord39 wrote:Then again, I can give him this:

14-x+2=8

Please, my pet pig could solve that one for x!  Mind you, he only spoke French.  

(NB:  The following joke only works with a rudimentary understanding of numerals in French.)

A lemur farmer had a pig that he claimed could solve mathematical questions.  When his friends expressed disbelief, he demonstrated.

Lemur Farmer: Pig, what is three times three?
Pig continues to eat slop, but mutters the correct result several times:  "Nuff nuff nuff nuff".
Lemur Farmer: Pig, what is eleven minus two?
Pig continues to eat slop, but mutters the correct result yet again:  "Nuff nuff nuff nuff".
Lemur's Unimpressed Friends:  Oh come on, the answer is always nine.  Pigs just make sounds like that.  It doesn't know math.
Lemur Farmer:  Fine.  I'll prove it.  Pig, what is two times four?
(Lemur then gives the Pig a sharp kick!)
Pig: Runs off squealing the correct answer: "Weet! Weet! Weet!".

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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:49 pm 
 

Aneoth wrote:
Concerta, Ritalin, Adderall, and other drugs were obviously in the kids systems. They all had some form of ADD, ADHD, or other horrific diseases that had to be treated with DRUGS.



HOLY CRAP don't get me started on this.  Seriously

My wife and I have not allowed ANY of her children to be doped up by the school so we can help them do their jobs.  My youngest daughter had a wild childhood...had a kid at 16...but she's shown herself to be an incredible mom and human being (had the baby, graduated high school a year early, is going to college, just got a job with the college, is married and pregnant with her second child).  When she was in high school our house was a revolving door for her friends that for one reason or another were having problems at home.......often from a one parent or no parent family, usually abusive, sometimes the parents were on drugs, sometimes the kids were being hit on by the mommy's boyfriend...and we invited these kids in to stay as long as they wanted.  Pretty much all of them had a much needed respite from the awfulness of their everday home life while living with us, and never got in trouble, made bad grades, or acted up one bit.

Interestngly, EVERY ONE OF THEM had been diagnosed with some vague "behavioral problem" or form of ADD and were being drugged out of their minds with Ritalin, anti depressants, and other mood and mind altering concoctions that often left them feeling depressed and suicidal.  Oddly enough, my wife and I must be the two most incredibly life affirming people on the planet  :roll: , because after staying with us for a few weeks these "problem" kids were happy, well adusted, and making good grades.  Oh, yeh, the common denominator was that in all cases the kids had left behind their mind altering drugs when they came to stay with us, and you could practically see the life come back into their eyes as their brain began to function again.

Not saying that SOME kids might need something like this, it can't be a picnic to teach hyperactive pre-teens.  But the over dosing of kids has gotten out of hand IMO.  The studies I've seen on kids over medicated when they are young are disturbing also, sometimes it has a long term effect.  And btw my middle brother was one of those "hyperactive" kids that would have been drugged into submission by overeager physicians had Ritalin been allowed to given to him by my parents.  As it was he found an outlet for his energy.....football...and became an all district RB for three years in a row.

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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 4:28 pm 
 

ADD doesn't exist, plain and simple. They're KIDS. They don't HAVE attention spans. They SHOULDN'T have attention spans.


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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 5:05 pm 
 

Deadlord39 wrote:ADD doesn't exist, plain and simple. They're KIDS. They don't HAVE attention spans. They SHOULDN'T have attention spans.


yeah, thats pretty much what I told the Nurse and his homeroom teacher.
They both glared at me with looks of disgust at my obvious ignorance.

Nonetheless, they relented. And I never gave him any Ritalin, or other mind altering drugs.

Of course most of the rest of my family informed me I was making a mistake.

Back when it all first started (When we took the boys from their mother) I wanted and offered to take BOTH of them, but I was told it would be too much for me to handle. My experienced sister could not then afford both of them so the boys were split up. Against my will and thiers too.

Two years later they took the one boy I had been allowed to foster, to live with my experienced sister....

".... its for the better" They said, "The boys should be together ya know?"

I once heard her tell me that she never spanked them.

Once on a visit to her house some time later, I watched as one of the boys had done something bad and I told her ida spanked his butt for it.
She looked at me like I was satan...... thats when she told me that its NEVER right to spank your kids.............
Actual words from her mouth...........
"He knows he did something wrong, that's punishment enough!"  :?
"He is going to have to deal with his bad behavior in his own way."  8O

:roll:

I asked her if she was certain that he could really deal with the guilt part of his punishment if he was always on mind altering drugs.

That question only got me another odd look and a disgusted smirk.......


"Guys, I am starting to think Tegel Manor might be haunted..."
Stated by me as a PC during a run of Tegel Manor DMed by killjoy at NTRPGCon 2010

Charter Member of the ATM

  


Long-Winded Collector
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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 8:49 pm 
 

Deadlord39 wrote:ADD doesn't exist, plain and simple. They're KIDS. They don't HAVE attention spans. They SHOULDN'T have attention spans.


With you there, Frank.  What a load of crap the whole fricken' concept of ADD is.


Let mirth prevail!

  

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Verbose Collector

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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:12 pm 
 

bombadil wrote:
With you there, Frank.  What a load of crap the whole fricken' concept of AD&D is.


8O  8O

(ok I admit I put the & in!)


You can never have too much of something you didn't need in the first place.

  

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Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:55 pm 
 

I believe they call it "fast food culture." That, and psychiatrists getting kickbacks each time they prescribe a medicine. Got to love how medicine works, these days.


Those who can, don't. Those who should not, do.

  
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