ciao folks, i'm here back with a new problem with an ebay reseller well known...
as usual, for the time being, i wont disclose his name...
this is the story (shortly): i bought an item, a very very d&d light item (even lighter than the adventure modules!) and he sent me an invoice as usual... i paid without any problem... when i got the item, i checked, as usual, the postal charge with the S&H fee and i found out that he applied 6 USD as handling fee... the problem is that he used as material a normal yellow paper envelope and an used global priority cardboard bag (inside the envelope)... this got me angry and i wrote him in oder to have confirmation that it was the correct handling fee...
(ah, in the auction description, it is stated that domestic handling fee are 2 USD while overseas handling fees may be 3-6 USD without any further explanation)
to get it short: he replied me that the charge was correct because my country has the highest rate due to the hassles they have to face in shipping to italy!!! nothing else than this... the size, the weight, the packing materials, nothing, nothing, nothing... only the country of destination!
i wrote him back telling that i had no problems in leaving him a negativa feedback for this... he offered me 2 USD of refund (wow, with paypal charges, better not to receive them...)
the point is, beyond any concrete financial matter, that i'm in doubt whether to leave a neg.feedback regardless the proposal or not: i feel that this is a question of principle! if i get my 2 bucks back in my pocket, this wont change the fact that he'll apply in the future again this method... maybe someone will read my neg.feedback and he'll loose customers if behaving in this way...

what is your suggestion: to give him a neg.fb or to cash in my 2 bucks and leaving others being fcked  by him repeatedly????

Beyondthebreach wrote:If he refunds you two dollars on your paypal payment, there will be no fee involved for you.  

He did say international handling fees of $3 - $6.  Of course, he charged you the highest amount, but he is refunding you $2.  He is holding up his end of the bargain (though it sounds like he didn't pack your items protectively).

Italy is slightly more difficult to ship to than other countries as Global Priority can't be used, therefore a seller needs to provide their own envelope.  Others have complained that the Italian postal system is unreliable, but I have NEVER had a problem with shipping to Italy (and I have sold more items to Italy than any other country besides the U.S.)

Aia, it boils down to this:  If you wanted an exact shipping quote, you should have emailed the seller.  If he says up to $6, then don't be surprised when it is $6 (and he is going to refund you a couple of dollars as well).  Perhaps you may want to leave him a NEG for not protecting the module with good packaging . . . though if it didn't incur damage because of this, then maybe not.

I agree with BTB....I've fallen into the same trap, not asking exactly what shipping was and being unpleasantly surprised.  However, can't believe the guy didn't plunk down the $1 for the nice padded envelope and backing that would have more ably protected your item.  I never use those paper envelopes for anything, they are worthless...especially overseas.  But he did give you a partial refund which is better than most would have done.

Mike B.

Remember . . . ripping people off with handling charges has been the way of things loooong before eBay came around.  All those crap pieces of multi-function kitchen gadgets usually have high shipping costs . . . everything does!  

Music collections, "Sounds of the 70's, Time-Life books, you name it!

 Money back guarantee!  (However, if you read the fine print, S&H is NOT refundable).

Back in the early 80's my Dad would mail order baseball cards all the time.  S&H rip offs were to be expected.  Hell, you even had to list 2nd and 3rd alternates in case what you wanted wasn't in stock!  You send the check for some item you see listed by name only and hope if arrives as promised (but maybe all Twenty items you wanted weren't on hand and you get the "alternates" instead. )

No buyer protection, no buyer recourse.  Maybe the seller would work with you, but your only defense was to only let him rip you off the one time!  Same with all those mail order comics . . .

If anything, things are a lot better these days then they used to be.  Most large companies have reasonable or discounted or free shipping since online business has become so commonplace.

MadMaligor wrote:I dont mind if the seller makes a couple bucks off of shipping, especially in an open bid forum where the item could get sniped for cheap.

I do!

If you want a specific price for an item, set a minimum bid, or a reserve bid, or make it a BIN only listing.  

Auctions do not favor the buyer, on average.  Most items of any real worth are bid sky high in the process.  Taking away the possibility of scoring something cheap, by allowing sellers to recover their prices on shipping/handling, defeats the purpose of holding an auction entirely.  That's as shady as it gets!

Both eBay and PayPal are heavily biassed in favour of the buyer. They also favour US citizens over foriegners, offering US buyers and sellers extra priviliges and protection against forigners.

If you ask anyone on this board who makes their living as an honest eBay trader who is in the most vulnerable position on eBay, they will tell you that the seller is.

It is natural for everyone to think they are worst off, but until you've been at the receiving end of most different types of disputes, you can't really be objective.

I would say on the whole that the seller believed he was being honest and dutiful because he left feedback without waiting to find out if you were satisfied. As regards a £3 handling fee, I would say that if he declared the cost of shipping prior to you placing your bid then it is fair, and if he did not declair shipping at all, he is duty bound to be 'reasonable' about such expenses.

$6 is a sum of money most people don't really care about in online trade. Put it down to experience and move on. I've been buying on eBay for four years or more. The exageration of shipping by $6 is very common among people who do not ship internationally every week. If you live outside of the USA you need to learn to accept this. Foreign trade is a very minor part of a lot of US sellers businesses and something they take a guess at. It's the only economical choice.

You are buying a US product from a US seller using a US agent and a US bank. Don't you think it's worth paying the extra $6 to ensure you get the same service a US buyer would get? I do.

Don't forget about the exchange rate--don't think it has been favorable to US$ much lately . . .          
Might be another reason U.S. sellers may charge more for international shipping--GBP 3.00 may be too much to cover international shipping by calling it a "handling charge"--but when the exchange rate can move by as much as +/- US$0.25-0.30=GBP 1.00** (as an example) in the time between an auction ending, payment received, package mailed off, and the package arriving overseas at the foreign post office, one may NOT want to have to deal with them sending your package back for insufficient postage!

**(Oops--I meant to say "+/- US$0.25-0.30 versus GBP 1.00")

I wouldn't leave a negative or a neutral if someone overcharged me by $6. That's going too far. I might be cautious about buying from him again and I might send an e-mail saying 'you chargem me X for handling', but getting into a disagreement for $6 is just not worth it. $6 is what? 15-20mins pay? I leave more than that as a tip at a retaurant. It's just going too far.

If you trade with someone and you feel you've lost out you should do the following...

1. Confront him directly via eBay and/or private e-mail. Be specific about your gievance and ask him to explain things from his point of view. Propose a solution that would leave you satisfied.

2. If you get no response, or you feel he is being unreasonable in maintaining his position, offer up his name and a description of events in the Shady Dealers section. This annonymous whinging is a waste of time. If you out someone in open forum in the appropriate thread (as opposed to starting a new one each time your purchase goes bad) then it gives the person an insentive to aire their opinion in public and hear the views of the group. That's what the community is for.

3. If you still get no satisfaction ask yourself "How much time am I willing to spend trying to recover my funds?", and then begin proceedings through PayPal or your Credit Card. For $6 IMHO you should just call it a loss and move on, but that's just me. I realise that $6 is a lot of money to some folks, but then they shouldn't be shopping for D&D if they were that hard up.

Finally, if they are one of the many known Shady deallers, coming online and cribbing about them is a waste of everyone's time. We all know the major dealers that screw people on shipping and exagerate the condition of their books. We've all had those discussions before and it would move things along much faster if you just said 'Mr X this', and we could say 'Yeah, read this thread here'.

The problem with this in most cases is that some charging a large handling fee does not disclose that fact.  So when you ask for a shipping quote you do not know how much is handling and how much is shipping.

If all of this is disclosed and the handling fee is high then chances are I would not even bid on the auction.  Sellers who charge a large handling fee do so to cover their costs of listing on Ebay and to cover any paypal charges, time to scan images and write the listing, etc.  These costs are not postage handling fees and should be priced into the auction starting price.

Sea-to-sky-games wrote:
This is an interesting point. However, if this occurred at all, and suppose God then decided this could no longer be done, what would happen to the number of items on eBay? What would happen to the prices?

Supply of goods would go down, prices would go up. Are buyers better off?

I am not exactly sure what God has to with handling fees?  Are you here just to troll this forum or something? Remind me never to buy from you as I am pretty sure that you will do everything in your power to screw out my eyeballs along the way while doing it.