FormCritic wrote:

MetamorphosisSigma wrote:
Yeah, but dead on this time, for the most part .

Aslan doesn't get a pass from me, though. Even when I was 11 and reading these, I got to the part where he surrenders himself as a sacrifice to save Edmund, and face met palm. I couldn't believe I hadn't seen it before that point, and it only goes downhill from there. Lewis was a hamfisted hack, IMO.

And except for Dune. There's a whole lot more going on there than commentary on Islam and oil. The book may be allegorical on some level, but it's more complex than that, and there's certainly no one-to-one correspondence between people/organizations/events in the book(s) and real life. Those Fremen (free men) dudes are American-style revolutionaries of some sort, for starters...

Lewis is a dork, unless the reader is sympathetic to his Christian viewpoint...on which he is both subtle and profound.  On a deeper level, in the Narnia novels Lewis isn't just blathering about Jesus.  He has a lot to say about moral dilemmas, human nature, the cycles of history, the cynicism of the modern world versus the wonder of childhood and the nature of God.

One thing to remember about the Narnia novels:  They are not evangelism.  They are a Christian thinker talking to other Christians about God.  Everyone else is just invited along as guests.

One of my favorite moments is in The Silver Chair, when a girl who is new to Narnia tries to reassure herself that Aslan wouldn't harm a young girl.  Aslan responds that not only would he harm little girls, he has swallowed entire nations.  God, speaking through Aslan, does not offer excuses, justifications or explanations.  That isn't kid stuff.  It is Lewis saying something about the nature of God that is worth discussing between adults.

Which is why I have avoided it like the bubonic plague. I have never been into Christian apologists, or any type of apologists, for that matter.

Some very good short works from Vance for those who prefer The Dying Earth to The Demon Princes but which get little mention are: The Dragon Masters, The Last Castle and the excellent The Miracle Workers from Fantasms and Magics.

Im reading The Island of Doctor Moreau again at the moment. I want to plant the guy on a lone mountain in my campaign.

I am quite a big fan of Terry Goodkind, liked all his Sword of Truth novels although I thought Law of Nines was a little weak.  Looking forward to his new one coming out in a few months.  I also like George R.R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire series and some D&D novels (early Dragonlance and R.A. Salvatore) too.  I also read some early 1st and 2nd century Judeo-Christian stuff and some history and archaeology stuff.

MetamorphosisSigma wrote:(just re-read all five Demon Princes recently

Do you prefer Demon Princes to Cugel? Im fairly surprised anyone does - I feel his language, thought and imagination are at their peak in the Dying Earth books (not to mention his PG Wodehouse influence.)

MetamorphosisSigma wrote:To my shame, I've yet to read anything by Wells other than The Time Machine, which I need to rectify soon.

The Island of Doctor Moreau is his best work I believe. There is an excellent film version with Charles Laughton as the doctor from 1932 (old !!).

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0024188/

MetamorphosisSigma wrote:Currently reading Jorge Luis Borges

I only read literature in translation if there is evidence that a translation exists to do justice to the original, which is often the case. Borges is one of literary figures I haven't been lucky enough to find a translation which gives me confidence enough to read him. My test is simple - 'Is this a fucking briliiant read?' If the answer is, 'no', then I blame the translator. Maybe you could recommend one.

I just got a reading copy of Lonely Vigils, by Manley Wade Wellman.

This is the 1981 Carcosa publishing collection of all of Wellman's Judge Pursuviant and John Thunstone stories.  It is dedicated to Karl Edward Wagner, with whom Wellman was apparently associated.

My copy is basically new, but without the dust jacket.  I got it for just over $20.

Reading about Thunstone, a theory is growing in my head about Thunstone and Silver John.

DiscoDadda wrote:A couple months back I picked up an anthology The Best of HP Lovecraft... primarily because several guys here gave Lovecraft 5 stars... I managed to read about 10 or so stories got about 1/2 way thru it before setting it aside.  Some of the stories were The Call of Cthulhu, The Hunter of Dark the Colour of Space, the Dunwich Horror... etc...  I found most to be okay and I can respect Lovecraft's ability to write... None of the stories really grabbed me and said you have to read this now!  Maybe its just too "old school" and I know this post will be sacreligious but the stories were kinda bland.

Probably my favorite was the Dunwich Horror which should have been a longer novel...

Also, there was one technique he seemed to use over and over again, where he would have the main character read the notes of a departed soul who was being driven crazy by some horror that was sooooo horrific, as to be >>>>>> "unspeakable" >>>>>> I really wish he would have described the "unspeakable" horror.... but then it would not have been "unspeakable"

Disco

Lovecraft is definitely a product of his times.....along with Robert Howard and Clark Ashton Smith he was one of the "Three Horsemen" of Weird Tales.  You have to take Lovecraft's stories as they are, perfect examples of 30's pulp fiction, rather than any sort of great literature.  Lovecraft was much more about setting and atmosphere, not a lot of action, but building a sense of dread and horror....definitely of the "old school" of not showing the gore onscreen, so to speak.  If you read some of his predecessors in the genre (Robert Chambers, Ambrose Bierce, Arthur Machen, Lord Dunsany and of course Edgar Allen Poe) you can see the progression in Lovecraft's works, even as he took the themes in a slightly different direction.

I don't know if you got to these, but my favorite Lovecraft tales are "The Shadow Over Innsmouth", "Dreams in the Witch-House", "The Temple" and "The Festival".

Mike B.

In many ways Lovecraft's work was ground breaking and set the direction for many other horror writers in the 20th century.

I enjoy Lovecraft, yet, also recognize he is a genre writer with a now problematic cultural stance.   He was sickly, sad, lonely, racist and an utter failure academically, financially and personally; his work derives from and is fed by these challenges.  Nonetheless, I am neither a target of his melancholy, nor his racism, so I am able to find the work atmospheric and enjoy it.  However, I discovered that I enjoyed it a bit more after living in CT/MA for a while.  (ie. Pips + Ipswich = Pipswich).  

Granted, Lovecraft occasionally suffered from madness and that madness suffuses his writing.  I expect that for some people the more of the madness, cultural, geographic, academic and other attributes one shares with Lovecraft, the easier it is to look past his failures (as a person and a writer) to his success as a storyteller.  His work is atmospheric, although he is somewhat overly fond of his vocabulary.  No Poe; rather blunter.  It is definitely worth delving into the work of Machen, Derleth, et. al. if you enjoy the genre.  And, what's not to enjoy?  I rather doubt Lovecraft is an acquired taste for adults.  One either enjoys Lovecraft, or not.  Perhaps, younger folk find the genre through him (or as a Stephen King referent) and learn to read the genre through Lovecraft and co.  

Meanwhile, I have been delving into steampunk literature and find corollaries.  The pace and dissemination of publication is faster now, so it is unclear to me that there is a dominant writer, or one I am "supposed" to read.  Please remedy my ignorance where you can!  Yet, the genre is generally atmospheric and awash with writers in love with their own wordsmithery.  One English academic philosopher chap (name escapes me)  who is proclaimed a genius on the book flaps is particularly guilty of such.  Occasionally, a writer might let the reader decide he is a genius by the quality of his writing and thought... rather than leaving him wondering if the writer suffers self esteem issues and writes with a thesaurus at side.

Conveniently, one sets aside Lovecraft's writing with the abiding sense that he is sharing what he knows and feels to be true.  His gift to us is the immediacy of the places he sets us down; the application of this gift to the horror genre is his greatest legacy.

JasonZavoda wrote:One of the greatest things that Lovecraft did was to encourage other writers like Clark Ashton Smith and Robert Bloch. He not only let other writers use the Cthulhu Mythos, he encouraged it, and used their contributions in his stories. If Lovecraft used some named book, monster or elder god from outer space then that was the seal of approval for its general use by all the other writers writing in the Mythos.

Absolutely. Even if Lovecraft's work was completely worthless, there are about six other authors (CAS, Leiber, Bloch, etc.) I couldn't do without who simply wouldn't have written what they did the way they did if it hadn't been for HPL's encouragement.