Early Dragon Magazine printings?
Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 1
Author

User avatar

Grandstanding Collector

Posts: 6070
Joined: May 03, 2003
Last Visit: Mar 29, 2021
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

Post Posted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 7:27 pm 
 

I am just wondering if there were different printings of the Dragon in the early issues?  I have two copies of #19 Oct 78 Vol III No. 5.  The book on one of them has been stapled in backwards - the cover opens to the upside down last page.  And the two copies are stapled in different places (the top staple is about 1 inch lower on one copy).  Is this indicative of different printings or just that one batch off the press was stapled at a different time from another batch?

 WWW  

User avatar

Verbose Collector
Acaeum Donor
Valuation Board

Posts: 1845
Joined: May 01, 2004
Last Visit: Apr 20, 2021
Location: Almost Lake Geneva, WI

Post Posted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 9:33 pm 
 

One large sheet is printed, folded 3 times, and run through an automatic cutter, producing a 16-page signature. Multiple signatures are collated, that again normally being automatic. If a magazine cover is of a heavier stock, or if it's 4-color process instead of black & white, it's printed on a different press (though still folded and cut), and stacked separately.

To do a saddle stitch (ie stapling) at that point, automation usually requires a large print run. It is often more cost-effective for a press worker to hold the collated signatures in place while a machine staples it. In this case the a cover is pulled from one pile, a collated page pack set atop it, and the whole positioned in place for the machine.

Sometimes the first of a batch is stapled wrong. The error is immediately obvious and easily corrected. These copies should be discarded, but aren't always.

Best guess: One of yours suffered that problem.
Secondary guess: Someone's cover came off (maybe even undamaged, if the staples didn't take) and they stapled it back in place, but with an oops.
Tertiary: Someone tried #2 deliberately to get more money for a 'misprint' (which is a misnomer; it's a post-press error, not a printing error).


I'm part-owner of a business supplying ink handling equipment to big presses, like the $25 mil (US) webs used to print Time, Newsweek, and other magazines. It's kinda neat to walk onto the press floor at times.

  

User avatar

Grandstanding Collector

Posts: 6070
Joined: May 03, 2003
Last Visit: Mar 29, 2021
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

Post Posted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 9:38 pm 
 

Interesting.  Thanks Frank!

 WWW  


Sage Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 2884
Joined: Nov 04, 2004
Last Visit: May 09, 2020

Post Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 12:34 am 
 

ExTSR wrote:Secondary guess: Someone's cover came off (maybe even undamaged, if the staples didn't take) and they stapled it back in place, but with an oops.

FWIW, this was my exact initial thought when I read your post.

 WWW  

User avatar

Grandstanding Collector

Posts: 6070
Joined: May 03, 2003
Last Visit: Mar 29, 2021
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

Post Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 11:19 am 
 

I bought this magazine in a larger lot of Dragons:



http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 8787146791



(which I think was a good buy as well).  The magazine is actually in excellent shape.  I filled in a couple of holes and upgraded a number of issues that I already had.



The cover doesn't have any extra holes where initial staples would be and the current staples are the same length and quality as the original ones used.  Also while matching up a number of the other earlier issues, I found that the staple placement is not very exact in most cases.  Both the top and bottom staples have variant positions.



I think that it is probably  Frank's Best guess and that this happened at the assembly stage.

 WWW  


Prolific Collector

Posts: 321
Joined: Apr 07, 2006
Last Visit: Apr 02, 2018

Post Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 9:49 am 
 

ExTSR wrote:One large sheet is printed, folded 3 times, and run through an automatic cutter, producing a 16-page signature. Multiple signatures are collated, that again normally being automatic. If a magazine cover is of a heavier stock, or if it's 4-color process instead of black & white, it's printed on a different press (though still folded and cut), and stacked separately.

To do a saddle stitch (ie stapling) at that point, automation usually requires a large print run. It is often more cost-effective for a press worker to hold the collated signatures in place while a machine staples it. In this case the a cover is pulled from one pile, a collated page pack set atop it, and the whole positioned in place for the machine.

Sometimes the first of a batch is stapled wrong. The error is immediately obvious and easily corrected. These copies should be discarded, but aren't always.

Best guess: One of yours suffered that problem.
Secondary guess: Someone's cover came off (maybe even undamaged, if the staples didn't take) and they stapled it back in place, but with an oops.
Tertiary: Someone tried #2 deliberately to get more money for a 'misprint' (which is a misnomer; it's a post-press error, not a printing error).


I'm part-owner of a business supplying ink handling equipment to big presses, like the $25 mil (US) webs used to print Time, Newsweek, and other magazines. It's kinda neat to walk onto the press floor at times.


Having worked in a bindery at one time for a year and a half, I'm almost sure (99%) that the error was caused somewhere in the initial setup (when most things go awry).  I'm not sure how much an error copy commands in the collecting business, but I'm sure if you look hard enough, you can find errors in most magazines.


Eulaliaaa!!!

 WWW  

User avatar

Grandstanding Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 6720
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Last Visit: Feb 02, 2021

Post Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 12:18 am 
 

Having worked in printing...I can say that it is amazing how many things can go wrong, even when everyone present is competent and careful.  There's just a lot of chances for errors to creep in.

Mark   8)


"But I have watched the dragons come, fire-eyed, across the world."

  

User avatar

Long-Winded Collector
Subweb Admin
JG Valuation Board

Posts: 4485
Joined: Nov 08, 2002
Last Visit: Apr 20, 2021
Location: Land of 10,000 ponds

Post Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 3:36 pm 
 

Concerning the 1st Best of Dragon Magazine book..I have A collectors copy and a normal copy, is there any difference between the two (value/contents/etc)?

ShaneG.

 WWW  

User avatar

Grandstanding Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 6720
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Last Visit: Feb 02, 2021

Post Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 3:41 pm 
 

Didn't know a collector's copy existed.  Aren't they all collector's copies?


"But I have watched the dragons come, fire-eyed, across the world."

  

User avatar

Long-Winded Collector
Subweb Admin
JG Valuation Board

Posts: 4485
Joined: Nov 08, 2002
Last Visit: Apr 20, 2021
Location: Land of 10,000 ponds

Post Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 4:16 pm 
 

MShipley88 wrote:Didn't know a collector's copy existed.  Aren't they all collector's copies?


Of the Best of.. It is the only one that I have that says 'Collectors Edition' along with the same one that does not.

ShaneG.

 WWW  

User avatar

Grandstanding Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 6720
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Last Visit: Feb 02, 2021

Post Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 9:47 pm 
 

Plaag wrote:
MShipley88 wrote:Didn't know a collector's copy existed.  Aren't they all collector's copies?


Of the Best of.. It is the only one that I have that says 'Collectors Edition' along with the same one that does not.

ShaneG.


   Oddly enough, I think I know what you mean.   :wink:
 
Mark    8)


"But I have watched the dragons come, fire-eyed, across the world."

  

User avatar

Prolific Collector

Posts: 465
Joined: Mar 27, 2006
Last Visit: Aug 08, 2016
Location: Eatin' hog-eyed peas in a hog-eyed town

Post Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 11:30 pm 
 

There were no second print runs.

We ran print one run only.

Individual issues sometimes had glitches. The printers learned along with us how to do them better.

I would suspect that any "Best of" with that Collector's distinction was a second print run after I left.


Nemesis of the Annoyingly Dense
Guidelines, not rules...

  

User avatar

Grandstanding Collector
Acaeum Donor

Posts: 6720
Joined: Jul 16, 2005
Last Visit: Feb 02, 2021

Post Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 11:56 pm 
 

It's just funny....putting a "Collector's Edition" tag on an item that was printed as....a collector's edition.

Mark   8)


"But I have watched the dragons come, fire-eyed, across the world."

  

User avatar

Verbose Collector
Valuation Board

Posts: 1921
Joined: Nov 16, 2002
Last Visit: Apr 20, 2021
Location: Ohio, The land without sun

Post Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 9:26 pm 
 

TSR produced revised editions of Best of The Dragon and Best of Dragon Vol. II.  Is this what you are calling the Collector's Edition?

  

User avatar

Long-Winded Collector
Subweb Admin
JG Valuation Board

Posts: 4485
Joined: Nov 08, 2002
Last Visit: Apr 20, 2021
Location: Land of 10,000 ponds

Post Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 6:56 am 
 

dbartman wrote:TSR produced revised editions of Best of The Dragon and Best of Dragon Vol. II.  Is this what you are calling the Collector's Edition?


So then the revised editions have the words 'Collectors Edotion' on the first page? Am just curious as at first glance I could not see any real difference between the copies.

ShaneG.

 WWW  
Post new topic Reply to topic Page 1 of 1