Advice sought for item not received
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Post Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 5:30 pm 
 

This is what happens with my EGG card.

I phone EGG and say I want to dispute an item on my bill dated XX/YY/ZZ for XX.XX$. They ask if I've tried to resolve the issue directly with the seller, etc. I explain I bought something and I've waited over a month. I've asked the seller for proof that it was posted. He's not being helpful, and now he's not responding to my e-mails.

They flag the item on their computer and send me a form for me to fill out and sign.

I receive a form that has a summary of what I said on the phone. I print out the eBay/PayPal transacrion screen dump, sign the form, and send the two items back to EGG in a prepaid envelope.

About two weeks later EGG recredit my card. They send me a letter saying I have been recredited, but that if the seller responds and demonstrates that the item was delivered, they'll take the money back off my account. Fair enough. I have my money back.

About a month later PayPal open an unresolved dispute on my account called 'Chargeback'. They do their investigation, and if they can prove the item was shipped and delivered they'll charge my card again. It also has a button that allows me to autorise a recharge in the event that the item turns up.

About a month after that everything goes away and sometimes people exchange negative feedback.


This week I've been mostly eating . . . chicken and wild rice soup.

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Post Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 6:56 pm 
 

mbassoc2003 wrote:This is what happens with my EGG card.

I phone EGG and say I want to dispute an item on my bill dated XX/YY/ZZ for XX.XX$. They ask if I've tried to resolve the issue directly with the seller, etc. I explain I bought something and I've waited over a month. I've asked the seller for proof that it was posted. He's not being helpful, and now he's not responding to my e-mails.

They flag the item on their computer and send me a form for me to fill out and sign.

I receive a form that has a summary of what I said on the phone. I print out the eBay/PayPal transacrion screen dump, sign the form, and send the two items back to EGG in a prepaid envelope.

About two weeks later EGG recredit my card. They send me a letter saying I have been recredited, but that if the seller responds and demonstrates that the item was delivered, they'll take the money back off my account. Fair enough. I have my money back.

About a month later PayPal open an unresolved dispute on my account called 'Chargeback'. They do their investigation, and if they can prove the item was shipped and delivered they'll charge my card again. It also has a button that allows me to autorise a recharge in the event that the item turns up.

About a month after that everything goes away and sometimes people exchange negative feedback.


Very clear and useful information.  Thank you.

Mark   8)


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Post Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:12 am 
 

Hi,

yes Ian, thanks for this.. I'm not sure though, if its going to be so
easy to continue to do a chargeback in the UK if paypal are involved.
I think the FSA comment below is starting to become better known:

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/cp/cp05_04.pdf

specfically within this:

"Case study 3: where the FSA decided not to become involved
Where section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 applies, a cardholder who
has used their credit card to pay for goods or services has a claim against the
card issuer for any breach of contract or misrepresentation by the supplier of
the goods or services.

FOS received a number of complaints against credit-card issuers, where the
general circumstances were as follows:
-- Mr Buyer holds a credit card issued by Card-issuer plc.
-- Mrs Seller is selling an item on the eBay internet auction site.
-- Mr Buyer makes the successful bid for the item being sold by Mrs Seller.
-- Payment is to made through PayPal (an FSA-regulated electronic money
institution)
-- Mr Buyer opens an account with PayPal.
-- Mr Buyer credits that account with a payment from his credit card issued
by Card-issuer plc.
-- PayPal transfers the payment from Mr Buyer's PayPal account to Mrs
Seller's PayPal account.
-- Mrs Seller withdraws the payment from her PayPal account.
-- Mrs Seller does not send the paid-for item to Mr Buyer.
-- Mr Buyer is unable to recover his payment through PayPal or eBay.
-- Mr Buyer claims reimbursement from Card-issuer plc.
Compared to the normal use of a credit card to buys goods in a shop, involving
PayPal introduces an additional stage in the chain of payment. So, does section
75 apply in such cases or not? That was an issue with wider implications for
card-issuers and their customers.
The FSA agreed this was not a matter for it. Issuing credit cards is not an FSAregulated
activity and the FOS was already liaising with the OFT (which is the
licensing authority under the Consumer Credit Act 1974).
The question was a legal one, but the amounts involved in each case were
comparatively small. The issue was not covered by the contemporaneous court
proceedings between the OFT and four card-issuers concerning aspects of
section 75.
In the spirit of the arrangements proposed in Chapter 4 of the CP, the FOS
invited the chairman of the Banking and Loans Liaison Group (on behalf of
the industry) and the Chairman of the Financial Services Consumer Panel (on
behalf of consumers) to each nominate an expert to provide input.
In the light of input from these experts, and from the OFT, the FOS concluded
that section 75 did not apply in the circumstances of the cases that had been
brought to it.
Annex B 3"

I'd be interested to know if people have started to get problems doing
chargeback as a result of this, and what people's experiences have been of trying
to recover all money purely using paypal?

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Post Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:06 am 
 

I have tried recovering funds through PayPal on more than a few occasions. PayPal is a  US company and is heavily biased towards US citizens. Because of US government policy, or the policies implimented by US companies, it is not possible for any non-US person to put their trust in the US run machine when they know the whole system is stacked against them.

ATM the only way I have of recovering funds from sellers in the US who don't ship is to chargeback on a credit card. If that ceases to be an option I would then only accept PayPal payments from Acaeum members, and make all US buyers pay in cash by registerred mail.

Note that Western Union is also illegal here in the UK because of the number of fraudulent transactions being conducted on eBay accepting WU payments.


This week I've been mostly eating . . . chicken and wild rice soup.

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Post Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 6:07 am 
 

muddy

is your seller in the UK and you are in the UK?

Al



  


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Post Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 8:49 am 
 

A few weeks ago I did a charge-back on my credit card for an off ebay transaction that went through paypal and the items did not arrive. I bank with First Direct here in the UK (who possibly have the best customer service of any bank in the world - no seriously - although apologies if this sounds like an ad  :lol: ).

ME (on the phone): "Hello, I have bought an item using paypal and it hasn't arrived"

Bank: "when did you buy it?"

ME:  (gives dates)

Bank: "was it for.. (gives amount)?

ME: "Yes"

Bank: "Those funds will be credited to your account"

And they were.  

Paypal dropped me a polite email saying that they were invesitgating the matter and then told me that the query had been resolved. It is that easy.


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Post Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 10:23 am 
 

[quote="killjoy32"]muddy

is your seller in the UK and you are in the UK?

Al[/quote]

Hi Al, my goods have all turned up now, so I won't need
to make a charge back, but I wondered if people were aware
of this debatable FSA comment..  not helpful I think. Unless anybody
has some success stories of getting money out of paypal without
a chargeback?

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Post Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:34 pm 
 

well whatever. the next person to con me is gonna get a damn good slapping thats for sure...chargeback or no chargeback :D

Al



  
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