Badmike wrote:Hell, I think when I first posted a long list of sale stuff in the classifieds years ago Frank said something like "look, another one of those scumbag dealers is posting his list of crap"

Certainly sounds like Frank!  

deimos3428 wrote:Ok, guys, this is no longer fun.  Everybody take a deep breath.  (You need oxygen in order to roll your eyes effectively and make caustic remarks, trust me, I'm a pro.)

It's upsetting that people I consider to be my friends are arguing so viciously with other people that I also consider to be my friends.  Take it to PMs, please, unless it's somehow constructive.

Good advice, lets get on with it.

Okay, let me get in my two cents in case this thread does in fact get locked. Let me first preface my comments by saying that I do hope that TFM decides to return to the site. I still believe he is fact a good person and that he has a ton to offer both this community and the hobby overall.

That being said, I am quite a bit concerned about what I percieve as at best the misinformation that was relayed in the auction. I have scene the scans that David was refering to in his previous psots and I can gaurentee that the cover scan is 100% the exact same cover as the ST1 that was sold back in November of 2004.   Whether or not TFM actually remebers the exact dates of the puchase of this module is not what concerns me, becasue I sometimes what I forget what I did yesterday and I would never expect some to perfectly remeber the date that purchase something that was well over 1 year ago.  What I do take issue with this is the remark about "I have never seen an ST1 that had its staples rusted, which to me is clearly not the truth.  Being that it is quite obvious  that cover scan matches the one sold in late 2004 that means unequivacably that the buyer of that ST1 did in fact recieve AND see an ST1 with rusty staples.  The question then becomes, "Why would someone go out of their way to say something that knew not to be true?".  I won't pretend to guess at the motivation behind it, but I guess you can't blame people who see smoke start to wonder if there is fire, which gets multiplied by 100 times when you look at the possibility of someone who is planning on spending in excess of $2000.00 on an item. I don't know about anyone else, but I can not afford to lose $2000.00 on a whim and above and beyond that NO ONE should have to either whether they can afford to or not. I think David may have been a bit harsh in detailing of the situation, but I can not argue with what is factually correct.

Above and beyond that, being one of the ones who tries to look out for everyone here, I take offence at the fact that anyone would attempt to belittle my efforts in my attempt to protect people from being ripped off.  I don't know if that attempt was directed at me or not  The fact of the matter is that unfortuantely I have let things that I know about people from this forum slip by in the past because I preceived it was in the best interests of the community to do so.  I can guarentee that if I shined light on some of the goings on behind the scenes about certain members,  that this place would never be the same again, as a matter of fact a lot of things about this hobby would forever and irrepairably changed.

zhowar wrote:

bclarkie wrote: I can guarentee that if I shined light on some of the goings on behind the scenes about certain members,  that this place would never be the same again, as a matter of fact a lot of things about this hobby would forever and irrepairably changed.

Sounds like a Lovecraft story. Secret knowledge that once uncovered will slowly drive you insane...

Kind of like finding out how much the wife spends on shoes, make up, and persoal supplies!!!    

morgansurname wrote:Kind of like finding out how much the wife spends on shoes, make up, and persoal supplies!!!    

Kind of like the wife finding out how much I spend on D&D.  

bclarkie wrote:I can guarentee that if I shined light on some of the goings on behind the scenes about certain members,  that this place would never be the same again, as a matter of fact a lot of things about this hobby would forever and irrepairably changed.

Of that, I have no doubt.  

Blackmoor wrote:

deimos3428 wrote:Ok, guys, this is no longer fun.  Everybody take a deep breath.  (You need oxygen in order to roll your eyes effectively and make caustic remarks, trust me, I'm a pro.)
It's upsetting that people I consider to be my friends are arguing so viciously with other people that I also consider to be my friends.  Take it to PMs, please, unless it's somehow constructive.

Good advice, lets get on with it.

Agreed.

Let me just address a point Brian and others brought up first; for which level-headed analysis, thanks.

bclarkie wrote:...What I do take issue with this is the remark about "I have never seen an ST1 that had its staples rusted", which to me is clearly not the truth.  Being that it is quite obvious  that cover scan matches the one sold in late 2004 that means unequivacably that the buyer of that ST1 did in fact recieve AND see an ST1 with rusty staples.  The question then becomes, "Why would someone go out of their way to say something that knew not to be true?".  I won't pretend to guess at the motivation behind it, but I guess you can't blame people who see smoke start to wonder if there is fire...

Yes. But no further than that the staples had been replaced or the booklet swapped. If I had been sure of any greater "fire", I would have said so.
As it was, my last post before end-of-auction just recommended evaluation of my previous posts but that I could not stop anyone from bidding.
If anyone had wished copies of the original scans, I was happy to forward those but preferred to leave the condition of the item up for sale to any re-scans carried out by the current seller.

The "fire" as far as I was concerned was deliberately invoking ("For those of you interested in provenance, I purchased it on eBay from a seller in GB a few years ago"), then driving coach-and-horses through the whole concept of "provenance" apparently for the benefit of the seller.
Regardless of who they were (and I did not know it was tfm), I would not expect deliberate attempts to hide the true history of a high-value item. The ST1 - as a whole - was not the one originally purchased, contrary to what was stated. And the line about having never seen a ST1 with staple rust was a "red flag".
*
Why should selling a high-end item with original purchase history plus a note re. staples being changed/new booklet inserted be deemed undesirable simply because that might hurt the sale price (or whatever other reason)?

The other element of the "fire" re. condition not being as good as stated in the text (e.g. "The two bottom corners have a little wear") did not need to be addressed further, thanks to btb posting those scans.
I merely stated that it would be a good idea to request further high-res scans, as required. Sensible advice when parting with hard-earned $.

OK, that's enough post... feel to PM/email, if desired.

deimos3428 wrote:I still think ST1 would have been better if it featured Acererak terrorizing Hommlet.

Yeah, until he ran into Byrne and Rufus, pal ... then there would be an old-school demi-lich ass-kicking for sure.

No one messes with Byrne and Rufus! (except for Warduke, maybe).

+++++

Aside: Sad to see so much ill will over ST1, the most utterly crap-tastic "module" ever produced. Strange how this POS seems to generate such negativity (just search any ST1-related thread here; they all feature heated discussions).

Nothing, really, to say except....  

Oh....and...

Q:  Why does Warduke switch sword hands?
A:  Because both of them itch to kill and kill.

bbarsh wrote:I am still waiting for those counterfeit tourny modules and Jade Hares to start cropping up.

And I'm still waiting for my cheque.  You get the fakes when I get my money, not a minute sooner.  Kinky's doesn't photocopy stuff for free, y'know.  

In the future, please keep our private transactions out of the main forums!  

(I kid because I care.  We all know I've never been to Kinky's...the transvestites in there scare me.  Kinkos?  What?  Seriously?   )