Sellers who infringed upon copyrights; reported.
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Post Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:33 pm 
 

Mars wrote:I think the intent of this thread is to after sellers like this:

eBay listings


Absolutely.


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Post Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 1:41 pm 
 

. wrote:Even though I have bought the PDF quite legally, and am allowed to print it out for my own use, I am not permitted to give either the PDF away, or the printout.

I don't know UK law, but you can give a legally obtained PDF away in the USA under the doctrine of first sale.  Title 17 of the US Code permits this action explicitly:

US Code, Title 17, Chapter 1, § 109(a) wrote:...the owner of a particular copy or phonorecord lawfully made under this title, or any person authorized by such owner, is entitled, without the authority of the copyright owner, to sell or otherwise dispose of the possession of that copy or phonorecord. ...


You own one copy of the PDF.  You can dispose of that particular legally obtained copy in any manner you'd like, including selling it.  Any printouts or copies made for fair use purposes must be disposed of at the same time as the original, or they would be a copyright infringement as soon as the original was disposed.

WotC's licensing withdrawal doesn't affect you at all.  ESD was licensed to create and distribute copies for non-personal use; now they are not.  You weren't licensed in the first place; you're permitted by law to transfer ownership of legally obtained copies and that doesn't change.

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Post Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 3:24 pm 
 

Thanks, Deimos.

I don't know if UK law is different, but seeing as the PDFs I bought were bought from US companies, through a US licensed website, I'd imagine sale of those comes under US law.

So I can burn all the PDFs I bought and sell them on a single CD, provided I then destroy all copies that may remain on my computer. So selling a DVD full of D&D stuff on eBay is perfectly legal and it presumably is the responsibility of WoTC to prove you obtained the PDFs illegally?


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Post Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 3:45 pm 
 

Mars wrote:I think the intent of this thread is to after sellers like this:

eBay listings


Absolutely, but I didn't think the list of books even looked that good anyway!   :lol:


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Post Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:20 pm 
 

. wrote:So I can burn all the PDFs I bought and sell them on a single CD, provided I then destroy all copies that may remain on my computer. So selling a DVD full of D&D stuff on eBay is perfectly legal and it presumably is the responsibility of WoTC to prove you obtained the PDFs illegally?

Um...in that case, yes it'd be technically legal, but it's not that simple.  It might be argued that by compiling them, you're creating a derivative work...this stuff gets complicated in a hurry.

The burden of proof is still on you if you're actually taken to court, as copyright law is a civil matter and not a criminal one.  You're not automatically "innocent until proven guilty", which is why the better lawyers will prevail.  ;)

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Post Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:25 pm 
 

For most compilations it probably isn't much of a stretch to say they were illegally obtained.  Most usually contain 100+ books which puts their original price at a few thousand dollars.  Not likely that the guy now only wants $2 for it.  Or that he bought 30 copies of each to resell, etc.

Although selling PDFs does seem to work out not too badly.  The guy I posted the other day has a rating of almost 200 on Ebay all through selling his pdfs.  If you look at his D&D auction under purchases:


** expired eBay auction **


He has sold about 25 copies in this latest auction already.  He's not making huge money but a few dollars each auction adds up.

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Post Posted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 4:39 am 
 

Not eBay but RPGNow.com

A month ago Gamelords listed all their Traveller digest back catalog in PDF form under the Gamelords label. Now Game Designers Workshop have done the same. Is this two companies who are starting a trend (and I'd be curious to know if Tadashi knows anything about this), or is someone selling else responsible. The PDFs are practically identical badly made scans, so the author is probably the same. But he could be scanning and selling to the authors for publication, or he could be doing this illegaly.


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Post Posted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 5:16 am 
 

Mars wrote:For most compilations it probably isn't much of a stretch to say they were illegally obtained.  Most usually contain 100+ books which puts their original price at a few thousand dollars.  Not likely that the guy now only wants $2 for it.  Or that he bought 30 copies of each to resell, etc.

Although selling PDFs does seem to work out not too badly.  The guy I posted the other day has a rating of almost 200 on Ebay all through selling his pdfs.  If you look at his D&D auction under purchases:


** expired eBay auction **


He has sold about 25 copies in this latest auction already.  He's not making huge money but a few dollars each auction adds up.


this guy being from Liverpool, is only ~20 miles from me. i have pulled him up twice before. i remember the name very well. he has had auctions pulled before. i have reported him, but would also appreciate a few others reporting too.

thanks

Al



  

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Post Posted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 8:03 am 
 

Mars wrote:For most compilations it probably isn't much of a stretch to say they were illegally obtained.  Most usually contain 100+ books which puts their original price at a few thousand dollars.  Not likely that the guy now only wants $2 for it.  Or that he bought 30 copies of each to resell, etc.

Although selling PDFs does seem to work out not too badly.  The guy I posted the other day has a rating of almost 200 on Ebay all through selling his pdfs.  If you look at his D&D auction under purchases:


** expired eBay auction **


He has sold about 25 copies in this latest auction already.  He's not making huge money but a few dollars each auction adds up.

A lot of those are free adventures from the WoTC website. Or at least they were when 3E first came out.


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Post Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:41 am 
 


** expired eBay auction **


Picture taken from the Forgetten Realms boxed set I believe.

  

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Post Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:09 pm 
 

JasonZavoda wrote:Picture taken from the Forgetten Realms boxed set I believe.


Is there an infringement on this type of thing?  I'm not sure if there is.  Maybe unauthorized use of the image?  So the artist is probably the copyright holder?

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Post Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 1:25 pm 
 

Mars wrote:
Is there an infringement on this type of thing?  I'm not sure if there is.  Maybe unauthorized use of the image?  So the artist is probably the copyright holder?


Nah, in the description it says she used forgotten 'collector's cards' to make the tiles. I recognize most of them from the 92 set..


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Post Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 3:56 pm 
 

Midian_Beasttoothe wrote:
Nah, in the description it says she used forgotten 'collector's cards' to make the tiles. I recognize most of them from the 92 set..


Even so, I don't know if that allows her to cut them up are use them in a different application for resale.

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Post Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:11 pm 
 

Mars wrote:
Even so, I don't know if that allows her to cut them up are use them in a different application for resale.


I'm not a lawyer, so this is just my opinion:

If she changed her description to "Custom Card Holder Necklace complete with Dungeons & Dragons Card" she would be in the clear.  A lawyer would argue that this is the same as selling a damaged baseball card, in a Plexiglas case designed to hang on the wall.   She is not selling the art as her own,she is simply repackaging art she has purchased for display in another manner.  

Now, all that being said:  If WotC got their panties in a bunch, they would put her in the poorhouse in court to prove she is in the right.  Sadly, that is how copyright litigation goes in this country.


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Post Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:27 pm 
 

killjoy32 wrote:
this guy being from Liverpool, is only ~20 miles from me. i have pulled him up twice before. i remember the name very well. he has had auctions pulled before. i have reported him, but would also appreciate a few others reporting too.

thanks

Al


I reported almost every one of them.  Don't seem to have gone anywhere.

  

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Post Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:12 am 
 

mordrin wrote:I reported almost every one of them.  Don't seem to have gone anywhere.

In copyright issues, eBay only act if the copyright holder contacts them direct and asks for a specific item to be removed. In those instances they will remove an item and place a warning on the seller's file. If your average guy in the street believes and item breaches copyright and complains about it, that is neither here nor there. It's one disgruntled browser's word against a seller, and eBay file it in their junk spam mail filter after sending out a autoreply. There is no use in reporting copyright violations to eBay unless you own copyright.

All that said, there is no way eBay can confirm whether or not you are a copyright holder. You can claim to have provided illustrations for a book contained on the CD and that it breaches your copyright. That is enough for them to pull an item.


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Post Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 12:49 pm 
 

Please report these eBay clowns.  These two may be the same person, as their D&D CDs had identical auction text:

. . . eBay listings
. . . eBay listings

  

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Post Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:25 pm 
 

JohnGaunt wrote:Please report these eBay clowns.  These two may be the same person, as their D&D CDs had identical auction text:

. . . eBay listings
. . . eBay listings


Only the copyright holder can have an item removed for copyright infringement. All you can do is buy it and then leave negative feedback and chargeback your CC. Anyways, at 99c it's not like they're even going to make a profit at it. They're running at a loss from the get go. Let's assume they gat the item for free, someone gives them free DVDs that are already burnt. Not likely, but let's assume. He packs it, and posts it for the price of the shipping and after paypal and ebay fees he's still losing money. The guy is working for free, putting in his own time, and even if al else pans out, he can only break even. The best thing you can do is buy the thing, cos it causes the guy to lose money and waste his time.


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Post Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:41 pm 
 

JohnGaunt wrote:Please report these eBay clowns.  These two may be the same person, as their D&D CDs had identical auction text:

. . . eBay listings
. . . eBay listings


Reported them both to Ebay and I also notified both Wizards directly and a couple of the other companies as well.  

The thing that makes these auctions even worse is that he is actually claiming redistribution rights with them as well.  In other words he's not only selling them, but he is effectively claiming that the companies in question have abandoned their own rights for the material, since he is claiming them.

Talk about a clusterf**k of stupidity, he's just begging to get a C&D letter and/or sued.


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Post Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 2:13 pm 
 

. wrote:In copyright issues, eBay only act if the copyright holder contacts them direct and asks for a specific item to be removed. In those instances they will remove an item and place a warning on the seller's file. If your average guy in the street believes and item breaches copyright and complains about it, that is neither here nor there. It's one disgruntled browser's word against a seller, and eBay file it in their junk spam mail filter after sending out a autoreply. There is no use in reporting copyright violations to eBay unless you own copyright.

All that said, there is no way eBay can confirm whether or not you are a copyright holder. You can claim to have provided illustrations for a book contained on the CD and that it breaches your copyright. That is enough for them to pull an item.


eBay routinely takes down copyrighted material.  I have sometimes reported stuff, and the overwhelming majority of the time they end up getting removed.  I find it hard to believe that they are only responding to copyright holders.  They are probably not legally liable, and it is hardly their highest priority, but eBay does seem to respond to copyright infringement to some degree.

Check out a site like ioffer.com, that is a site that responds (or does not respond) as you describe.  Almost everything on there is pirated goods, but ioffer simply looks the other way as they take the position that they are not legally liable.

  
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