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Reguarding Multi-Class in original AD&D
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Left_Behind_Subject
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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:00 am

Greetings fellow collectors,
I am curious about multi-class PCs in 1st Edition. Did a character use the most favorable Saving Throws, best on the Attack Matrices, the highest number of weapon + non-weapon proficiencies, and the lowest penalty for using a weapon not wroficient in during battle?
I know that in 1st Edition a Fighter/Cleric could use edged weapons, a Fighter/Magic-user could wear armor, but thief multi-class combinations had to obey thief restrictions. But some of those other details are unclear to me that I mentioned in the above paragraph. (I know how things worked in 2nd Edition but I still don't know about 1st Edition.) Thank you for all your help.
~The Left Behind Subject

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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:03 am

Howdy,

Left_Behind_Subject wrote:Greetings fellow collectors,
I am curious about multi-class PCs in 1st Edition. Did a character use the most favorable Saving Throws, best on the Attack Matrices, the highest number of weapon + non-weapon proficiencies, and the lowest penalty for using a weapon not wroficient in during battle?

Yes, you have it correct. Welcome!

Futures Bright,

Paul

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Deadlord
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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:39 pm

I blocked fighter/clerics from using edged or pointed, and I obviously didn't allow mages to cast in armor. Thieves just suffered massive penalties.

Blackmoor
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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:47 pm

Deadlord36 wrote:I blocked fighter/clerics from using edged or pointed, and I obviously didn't allow mages to cast in armor. Thieves just suffered massive penalties.

Typical 1st ed restrictions. *choke* *gasp*, need room to move but there is none

:) :)

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deimos3428
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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:50 pm

Deadlord36 wrote:I blocked fighter/clerics from using edged or pointed, and I obviously didn't allow mages to cast in armor. Thieves just suffered massive penalties.

I didn't realize until I was flipping through the books recently that elven F/MUs were allowed (well, according to the PHB) to cast spells in armor. 8O That's just wrong, but strangely never became an issue in our games. No wonder people loved playing elves...

Left_Behind_Subject
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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 2:47 pm

deimos3428 wrote:I didn't realize until I was flipping through the books recently that elven F/MUs were allowed (well, according to the PHB) to cast spells in armor. That's just wrong, but strangely never became an issue in our games. No wonder people loved playing elves...

It's true. I first realized this when I bought the old Dragonlance modules and tool a look at the character of Gilthanas. The second adventuring party I joined by the way had four elfin Fighter/Mages. I still don't understand how we survived. (Actually I do, using my Ring of Fire Resistance I swam thru the magma of a volcano to retreive the Eye and Hand of Vecna, but that's a seperate story.) It's a tempting combo as you can fight with weapons and blast away with spells.

But I'm still curious about the saving throws, proficiencies, and Attack Matrices from original AD&D with regards to multi-class characters. Did you use the worse of the classes or the best?

~The Left Behind Subject

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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 3:41 pm

Howdy,

Blackmoor wrote:
Deadlord36 wrote:I blocked fighter/clerics from using edged or pointed, and I obviously didn't allow mages to cast in armor. Thieves just suffered massive penalties.

Typical 1st ed restrictions. *choke* *gasp*, need room to move but there is none

Yes, by all means. Don't stick to archetypes that are easy for players to pick-up. They'll have a much better experience playing a half-monkey/gelatinous cube, paladin/armiger/assassin/souffle specialist.

Futures Bright,

Paul

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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 3:44 pm

Howdy,

Left_Behind_Subject wrote:But I'm still curious about the saving throws, proficiencies, and Attack Matrices from original AD&D with regards to multi-class characters. Did you use the worse of the classes or the best?

The best.

Futures Bright,

Paul

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deimos3428
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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 3:53 pm

Left_Behind_Subject wrote:But I'm still curious about the saving throws, proficiencies, and Attack Matrices from original AD&D with regards to multi-class characters. Did you use the worse of the classes or the best?

Worst restrictions, best attributes is the general rule, I believe.

Attributes -- saves, attack matrices, proficiencies, are taken from the better class. Any form of restriction would take the most restrictive version.

The F/C edged-weapon rule was an exception, and one that I would modify in my "house rules", as it doesn't make much sense.

F/MUs could wear armor and still obtain experience, but not cast spells in it. Similarly, F/Ts could try to use their skills, but as most require stealth/agility, there were established penalties.

Deadlord
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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 3:58 pm

Hey, that's right, I forgot, there ARE no restrictions in 3E! Why shouldn't a thief be able to climb walls in full plate? It's not like it would be difficult. And if he falls, he can use his 'Fall 10,000 and Suffer 0 Damage' feat (I think they get that as a freebie at 1st level). Then again, if he is an Obsidian Dragon/Green Slime/Kobold thief/shaman/paladin, he can just fly. Or he can take the 'Teleport Anywhere in the Known Universe" feat at 3rd level. Or he can roll against his Invincible skill. Or he can land on his feet and let his damage reduction save him. Or he can invoke the Levitation power of his +27 holy vorpal dancing sword of allslaying. Or.....

Blackmoor
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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 4:23 pm

Deadlord36 wrote:Hey, that's right, I forgot, there ARE no restrictions in 3E! Why shouldn't a thief be able to climb walls in full plate? It's not like it would be difficult. And if he falls, he can use his 'Fall 10,000 and Suffer 0 Damage' feat (I think they get that as a freebie at 1st level). Then again, if he is an Obsidian Dragon/Green Slime/Kobold thief/shaman/paladin, he can just fly. Or he can take the 'Teleport Anywhere in the Known Universe" feat at 3rd level. Or he can roll against his Invincible skill. Or he can land on his feet and let his damage reduction save him. Or he can invoke the Levitation power of his +27 holy vorpal dancing sword of allslaying. Or.....

At least you are consistant :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Left_Behind_Subject
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Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 5:00 pm

Deadlord36 wrote:I blocked fighter/clerics from using edged or pointed, and I obviously didn't allow mages to cast in armor. Thieves just suffered massive penalties.

Interestingly in Second Edition it became less useful to play a fighter/mage. For one thing a multi-classed fighter cannot have weapon specialization. (Not the case in First Edition.) It was also made a formal rule that mages cannot cast spells wearing armor. And in both editions an elfin Fighter/{Mage/Magic-user} was a lesser combination because as warriors gain a Hit Point bonus for high Constitutions elves inherently loose out on that because of racial modifiers. (A much better one was an elfin Mage/Thief since Rogues get bonuses for not wearing armor and elves get an improved dexterity.) The best combination in both Editions I think is the gnome Illusionist/Thief.

~Thomas

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Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 5:32 pm

Ironically, in 3.5 the wide-open rules make player characters free to accept all restrictions....armor, weight allowance, whatever....and they discourage fighter/mage characters because you end up sucking at both classes.

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MrFilthyIke
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Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 9:24 pm

MShipley88 wrote:Ironically, in 3.5 the wide-open rules make player characters free to accept all restrictions....armor, weight allowance, whatever....and they discourage fighter/mage characters because you end up sucking at both classes.

Very true.

I just read that F/MU could wear armor in 1e, I'm starting to like 1e more (though the racial levels limits still irk me). Need to get a copy of the DMG out.

There are no bad editions of D&D, just Boring Players and Unimaginative DMs.

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