Difference in quality among the AD&D PHB printings
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Post Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 8:45 pm 
 

I own an Easley PHB, an 8th printing PHB, 2 4th-7th printing PHBs, and now a very minty 3rd printing PHB.

I've noticed a definite difference in quality between my 3rd printing PHB and the rest. I always knew the Easley PHBS were lesser binding quality, but even my 4th-8th printing PHBs are not as robust as the 3rd! The 3rd printing PHB first of all has that nice heavy weight orange fly leaf inside sleeve. The binding seems bigger and more durable than the other PHBs (which have nice bindings themselves!). The pages in the 3rd printing are on thicker more stiff paper tool heavier weight. When I line up my PHBs and look across the spines you can tell the 3rd printing one is thicker.

I'm not imagining things am I? LOL.


I love that 3rd printing PHB I picked up. Its easily NM condition too!

  


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Post Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 8:40 am 
 

Kered0871 wrote:I own an Easley PHB, an 8th printing PHB, 2 4th-7th printing PHBs, and now a very minty 3rd printing PHB.

I've noticed a definite difference in quality between my 3rd printing PHB and the rest. I always knew the Easley PHBS were lesser binding quality, but even my 4th-8th printing PHBs are not as robust as the 3rd! The 3rd printing PHB first of all has that nice heavy weight orange fly leaf inside sleeve. The binding seems bigger and more durable than the other PHBs (which have nice bindings themselves!). The pages in the 3rd printing are on thicker more stiff paper tool heavier weight. When I line up my PHBs and look across the spines you can tell the 3rd printing one is thicker.

I'm not imagining things am I? LOL.


I love that 3rd printing PHB I picked up. Its easily NM condition too!
One word: stitched.  I believe all printings after the third were glued...

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Post Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 8:51 am 
 

I have a 4th print PHB that's sewn, so it's not possible that bindings after third were glued.  Given that the 9th print DMG specifically says it's glued (as shown on The Acaeum's page for that book), it stands to reason that anything pre 6th print for the Monster Manual, and anything pre 8th print for the Player's Handbook would be sewn.  For 6th print Monster Manuals and 8th print Player's Handbooks, being that they were printed in the same time frame as the 9th print DMG (1981), and the same change was made to the covers (replacing the wizard logo with the face logo) plus the likelihood of the same bookbinder being used for all three books brings me to the conclusion I had stated regarding sewn bindings.

I'm probably wrong with that theory, but what else is new?



  


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Post Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 8:59 am 
 

Traveller wrote:I have a 4th print PHB that's sewn, so it's not possible that bindings after third were glued. Given that the 9th print DMG specifically says it's glued (as shown on The Acaeum's page for that book), it stands to reason that anything pre 6th print for the Monster Manual, and anything pre 8th print for the Player's Handbook would be sewn. For 6th print Monster Manuals and 8th print Player's Handbooks, being that they were printed in the same time frame as the 9th print DMG (1981), and the same change was made to the covers (replacing the wizard logo with the face logo) plus the likelihood of the same bookbinder being used for all three books brings me to the conclusion I had stated regarding sewn bindings.

I'm probably wrong with that theory, but what else is new?

Well, I haven't completed my PHB print run yet, so I was just guessing.  :oops:   I'm confusing stitching with striped inlay again, anyway.

On the MM front, though, I can confirm up to the 5th is stitched.  They just get harder to see without the red flyleaf...presumably the same pattern with the PHB/DMG.

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Post Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 4:43 pm 
 

Don't sweat it.  The only reason I know that the 4th print was sewn was that I had to perform surgery on the book in order to get it into playing condition.  The text block had completely seperated from the spine and the only thing holding the text block together was the stitches in the text block.  I ended up slicing the endpaper at the edge of the hinge fabric and pulled it away from the cover so I could get to the spine and glue the text block back to the spine.



  


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Post Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 10:49 am 
 

My paperback PHB has now fallen apart (uk 2nd print)

I've only had it 18 months (purchased in 'fair' condition)

But hey, I don't care - it only for the players - I've got my own 7th print :-)

BJS

  


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Post Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 1:16 pm 
 

b_stedman wrote:My paperback PHB has now fallen apart (uk 2nd print)

I've only had it 18 months (purchased in 'fair' condition)

But hey, I don't care - it only for the players - I've got my own 7th print :-)

BJS

Erm, you didn't just say you had a 2nd GW MM and that its spine was previously intact....?  :?   ... :cry: :cry:

  

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Post Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:09 pm 
 

My 1st Edition PHB is in terrible shape too. Had forever, used it alot back in the day. Now the spine is coming undone and it's falling apart.
With the kind of experiences I've heard about from folks on these boards, I'm really turned off by the idea of buying anything from some unknown annonymous Ebayer.
Wonder where I could find an honest, respectable seller/dealer who's got a spare one in better condition?  Hmmmmm.....
:D

  

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Post Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:45 pm 
 

Agent Cooper wrote:Wonder where I could find an honest, respectable seller/dealer who's got a spare one in better condition? Hmmmmm.....
:D


well i dont doubt theres any number of guys who would prb part with theirs from here for the right price AC...

Al



  


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Post Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 8:57 pm 
 

Agent Cooper wrote:My 1st Edition PHB is in terrible shape too. Had forever, used it alot back in the day. Now the spine is coming undone and it's falling apart.
With the kind of experiences I've heard about from folks on these boards, I'm really turned off by the idea of buying anything from some unknown annonymous Ebayer.
Wonder where I could find an honest, respectable seller/dealer who's got a spare one in better condition? Hmmmmm.....
:D

Apologies to everyone I don't mention, and I'm not playing favorites here,  but some reputable eBay resellers (and Acaeum members) off the top of my head:

beyondthebreach, juliabulia, guido-the-gypsy, reindeergames, badmike.

There are many many many others..a 1st Ed. PHB is a pretty common item, you should be able to pick up one in useable condition for $10-20.  Now, a 1st printing PHB, that's another story. ;)

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Post Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 9:08 pm 
 

deimos3428 wrote:
Agent Cooper wrote:My 1st Edition PHB is in terrible shape too. Had forever, used it alot back in the day. Now the spine is coming undone and it's falling apart.
With the kind of experiences I've heard about from folks on these boards, I'm really turned off by the idea of buying anything from some unknown annonymous Ebayer.
Wonder where I could find an honest, respectable seller/dealer who's got a spare one in better condition? Hmmmmm.....
:D

Apologies to everyone I don't mention, and I'm not playing favorites here, but some reputable eBay resellers (and Acaeum members) off the top of my head:

beyondthebreach, juliabulia, guido-the-gypsy, reindeergames, badmike.

There are many many many others..a 1st Ed. PHB is a pretty common item, you should be able to pick up one in useable condition for $10-20. Now, a 1st printing PHB, that's another story. ;)


Geez, what does a guy have to do to get noticed around here, try to sell a set of R1-R4 modules for $1800.00. :o No more 1st printing DMGs for you Mr Deimos. :P {j/k}


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Post Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 9:11 pm 
 

bclarkie wrote:
deimos3428 wrote:Apologies to everyone I don't mention, and I'm not playing favorites here, but some reputable eBay resellers (and Acaeum members) off the top of my head:

beyondthebreach, juliabulia, guido-the-gypsy, reindeergames, badmike.

There are many many many others..a 1st Ed. PHB is a pretty common item, you should be able to pick up one in useable condition for $10-20. Now, a 1st printing PHB, that's another story. ;)


Geez, what does a guy have to do to get noticed around here, try to sell a set of R1-R4 modules for $1800.00. :o No more 1st printing DMGs for you Mr Deimos. :P {j/k}

:lol: I knew I was going to get into trouble when I started listing names!  (Actually I don't consider you a reseller, B.  Just a collector with too many doubles  :P )

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Post Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2005 9:13 pm 
 

deimos3428 wrote: :lol: I knew I was going to get into trouble when I started listing names! (Actually I don't consider you a reseller, B. Just a collector with too many doubles :P )


To true my friend, to true. :oops:


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Post Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:18 pm 
 

So if I prefer to deal with one of these folks, would it be considered bad form to contact one of them directly via the Acaeum site?   I wasn't kidding when I said I was afraid of Ebay!  I don't know what the etiquette is here concerning this, considering this is primarily a site for collectors.  Which technically, I am not, although there may be an element of denial in that statement.    :wink:

  


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Post Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 7:56 pm 
 

Agent Cooper wrote:So if I prefer to deal with one of these folks, would it be considered bad form to contact one of them directly via the Acaeum site?  I wasn't kidding when I said I was afraid of Ebay! I don't know what the etiquette is here concerning this, considering this is primarily a site for collectors. Which technically, I am not, although there may be an element of denial in that statement.  :wink:

I don't think any of them would mind you sending a PM.  However, your best bet would be to place a want add in the classifieds forum...

(If for some crazy reason you can't find a seller, I could be persuaded to part with one...I'm up to seven, but I'm slowly trying to complete the entire set of printings.)

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Post Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 5:16 am 
 

Kered0871 wrote:I own an Easley PHB, an 8th printing PHB, 2 4th-7th printing PHBs, and now a very minty 3rd printing PHB.

I've noticed a definite difference in quality between my 3rd printing PHB and the rest. I always knew the Easley PHBS were lesser binding quality, but even my 4th-8th printing PHBs are not as robust as the 3rd! The 3rd printing PHB first of all has that nice heavy weight orange fly leaf inside sleeve. The binding seems bigger and more durable than the other PHBs (which have nice bindings themselves!). The pages in the 3rd printing are on thicker more stiff paper tool heavier weight. When I line up my PHBs and look across the spines you can tell the 3rd printing one is thicker.

I'm not imagining things am I? LOL.

I love that 3rd printing PHB I picked up. Its easily NM condition too!


I collect Folio Society books because of the attention paid to a book's construction and the superior paper quality. I remember being taken by surprised by the sheer quality of an early printing MM I bought particularly the thick springy paper.

I have been informed that the DMG never received this treatment which is a shame however reading this thread I now know that there is a PHB built to the same standard and I want one!

If anyone has a 2nd or 3rd printing of the PHB in excellent (bright cover-no pen markings) condition for sale (assuming it has this superior paper) do let me know.

==========

I recommend making a note about the paper quality in your Rulebooks & Sets index. I don't think the distinction is noted for the PHB.

  

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Post Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:05 am 
 

Nice to encounter another connoisseur of fine bindings/materials in book construction :). I'm a collector of folio society and other similar books, too.

While I'm by no means an expert on the various MM and PHB printings, I have a 6th print PHB with orange flyleaves and the heavy stock paper. It's difficult to say if it is up to the same level of quality as the earlier printings, but it's pretty darn solid, and I can't discern much difference. Once you get past the 6th print PHB (true sixth, they all say 6th after that point), it does all go downhill, and as you say the DMG never got the same treatment (though the earlier printings still have sewn bindings and I've never known one to fall apart like the "orange spine" printings of all of the hardcovers do).


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Post Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:16 am 
 

wrt Folio Society, I have replaced most of my favourite books in paperback form with nice hardback editions and all of my best fantasy novels with the original hardbacks. Ive done this in the last twelve months and have taken quite a financial hammering, ha!

Books and food are both worth paying relatively high prices for in my view and it is only in modern times that degraded versions of both have been made available cheaply for mass consumption. 'Expensive' nowadays is actually 'normal' and still great value.

MetamorphosisSigma wrote:I have a 6th print PHB with orange flyleaves and the heavy stock paper... Once you get past the 6th print PHB (true sixth, they all say 6th after that point), it does all go downhill

Hmm. Now Im confused. The OP says

Kered0871 wrote:even my 4th-8th printing PHBs are not as robust as the 3rd! ...  The pages in the 3rd printing are on thicker more stiff paper tool heavier weight.

I suppose Im safest in aiming to get hold of a 2nd or 3rd printing. The variation in the printings of the core books is remarkable and it would be a nightmare getting what you want without the Acaeum.

  

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Post Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2012 8:31 am 
 

Bloom wrote:wrt Folio Society, I have replaced most of my favourite books in paperback form with nice hardback editions and all of my best fantasy novels with the original hardbacks. Ive done this in the last twelve months and have taken quite a financial hammering, ha!


I've been going through this process for about 7 - 9 years now, unconsciously at first. Our income starting increasing, so I began to pick up hardcover replacements "for the heck of it". Then, I began to enjoy them for themselves. I'm not necessarily a 1st edition seeker, but I have tried to acquire well-designed editions with superior materials. My paperbacks (for the most part) are now either gone or relegated to the limbo of a box in my closet :).

Books and food are both worth paying relatively high prices for in my view and it is only in modern times that degraded versions of both have been made available cheaply for mass consumption. 'Expensive' nowadays is actually 'normal' and still great value.


This is precisely my view. My grocery bill reflects that philosophy, too, LOL.

Hmm. Now Im confused. The OP says

Kered0871 wrote:
even my 4th-8th printing PHBs are not as robust as the 3rd! ... The pages in the 3rd printing are on thicker more stiff paper tool heavier weight.


This is correct, I believe. The 6th I have is on heavier stock (and more than adequate, IMO) paper, but the earlier (1st - 3rd) printings are on even heavier paper. The bindings are also still sewn, up to around the 8th print of the PHB. Deimos here (inactive lately) could probably tell you more about the relative merits of the bindings, but IIRC if you count the stitches between the front pastedowns and the ffep, you'll find there is some variation, and not always in the direction of "more, later", though I think the earliest MM and PHB prints have a higher count than the rest.

I decided on retaining the latest prints I could get that still have superior (if not quite the best ever used, which I think was overkill) paper and sewn bindings, because there are illustrations and some errata incorporated into the later ones that were missing in the earlier. Hope that made sense.


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Post Posted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 6:15 pm 
 

MetamorphosisSigma wrote:I'm not necessarily a 1st edition seeker, but I have tried to acquire well-designed editions with superior materials. My paperbacks (for the most part) are now either gone or relegated to the limbo of a box in my closet :).

Im the same. Im not a 1st edition collector except when, as is often the case, the book is coincidently of better quality than any subsequent printings. For example Beevor's Stalingrad is printed now by The Folio Society and I will get that instead of the Hardback 1st edition. When I was younger I did not notice how filthy many of the paperbacks i considered made up part of my library were. As many were hard to find paperbacks I was glad to get anything - it took me two years to get my hands on Cugel's Saga in the Early nineties. Abebooks has revolutionised all that.

MetamorphosisSigma wrote:Hope that made sense.

Yes, very useful. I'll make a post in the classified thread soon. Any idea if a 2nd/3rd printing PHB is rare - involves along wait? I expect to pay about $50 for a nice one.



  
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