A "new" DMG 1st variant?
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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:32 am 
 

Hey all...



Long story short, I hit my local favorite used bookstore the other day and to my amazement, for $5 each I found a true 1st Monster Manual, with lizard logo, a 1st (not a True 1st) player's handbook and a DMG.  They are all in fair condition; some fading and shelfwear; the pages inside are crisp and clean with no markings whatsoever.  Huzzah!



So on to the DMG.



Here's the rundown:



Red/Yellow striped cloth binding?  Check.

Textblock stitched 5/8"?  Check.

TSR (Wizard) Logo & Address on spine?  Check.

232 pp?  Check.

"D" in "Advanced" curled over?  Negative.  However, the text is not centered.  Another 16th of an inch or possibly less and the "D" would run off slightly.

Yellow-Orange flyleaves?  Check.



See, this to me seems to fall somewhere in between the True 1st and 3rd alpha.  It shares the features of a True 1st (red/orange cloth spine, large "ADVANCED D&D" logo almost running off the page...) and a 3rd Alpha.  Maybe it's time for a "3rd gamma" now? :)

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:39 am 
 

DungeonDelver wrote:Hey all...



Long story short, I hit my local favorite used bookstore the other day and to my amazement, for $5 each I found a true 1st Monster Manual, with lizard logo, a 1st (not a True 1st) player's handbook and a DMG. They are all in fair condition; some fading and shelfwear; the pages inside are crisp and clean with no markings whatsoever. Huzzah!



So on to the DMG.



Here's the rundown:



Red/Yellow striped cloth binding? Check.

Textblock stitched 5/8"? Check.

TSR (Wizard) Logo & Address on spine? Check.

232 pp? Check.

"D" in "Advanced" curled over? Negative. However, the text is not centered. Another 16th of an inch or possibly less and the "D" would run off slightly.

Yellow-Orange flyleaves? Check.



See, this to me seems to fall somewhere in between the True 1st and 3rd alpha. It shares the features of a True 1st (red/orange cloth spine, large "ADVANCED D&D" logo almost running off the page...) and a 3rd Alpha. Maybe it's time for a "3rd gamma" now? :)




What you are loking at is not a 1st print. The reason that the D runs of the page on the 1st print is because of the fact that it is much larger than the later prints. The banner on the 1st print DMG is 2", and reduced to 1 3/4" on later prints. Additionally, check the Wizard Logo, if it were a 1st print it would be covering the wizard with the fireball's foot. If your doesnt it is not a 1st print.


"He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." -Neitzche

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:45 am 
 

bclarkie wrote:
DungeonDelver wrote:Hey all...



Long story short, I hit my local favorite used bookstore the other day and to my amazement, for $5 each I found a true 1st Monster Manual, with lizard logo, a 1st (not a True 1st) player's handbook and a DMG. They are all in fair condition; some fading and shelfwear; the pages inside are crisp and clean with no markings whatsoever. Huzzah!



So on to the DMG.



Here's the rundown:



Red/Yellow striped cloth binding? Check.

Textblock stitched 5/8"? Check.

TSR (Wizard) Logo & Address on spine? Check.

232 pp? Check.

"D" in "Advanced" curled over? Negative. However, the text is not centered. Another 16th of an inch or possibly less and the "D" would run off slightly.

Yellow-Orange flyleaves? Check.



See, this to me seems to fall somewhere in between the True 1st and 3rd alpha. It shares the features of a True 1st (red/orange cloth spine, large "ADVANCED D&D" logo almost running off the page...) and a 3rd Alpha. Maybe it's time for a "3rd gamma" now? :)




What you are loking at is not a 1st print. The reason that the D runs of the page on the 1st print is because of the fact that it is much larger than the later prints. The banner on the 1st print DMG is 2", and reduced to 1 3/4" on later prints. Additionally, check the Wizard Logo, if it were a 1st print it would be covering the wizard with the fireball's foot. If your doesnt it is not a 1st print.




The wizard is covering the m-u's foot.



Is a scan or photo in order, folks?

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:49 am 
 

DungeonDelver wrote:
bclarkie wrote:


What you are loking at is not a 1st print. The reason that the D runs of the page on the 1st print is because of the fact that it is much larger than the later prints. The banner on the 1st print DMG is 2", and reduced to 1 3/4" on later prints. Additionally, check the Wizard Logo, if it were a 1st print it would be covering the wizard with the fireball's foot. If your doesnt it is not a 1st print.




The wizard is covering the m-u's foot.



Is a scan or photo in order, folks?




Yes, that would be good, as a matter of fact several pics would be good. Then again if the only difference is that your bannerred D is not curling off the page, it majust simply be a printing anomally created when the banner was put on, rather than a new 1st print.


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:55 am 
 

I'm warming up the scanner right now.  Many images are comin'!

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:07 am 
 

DungeonDelver wrote:I'm warming up the scanner right now. Many images are comin'!




It is probably best if you just post the cover scan, as if what I suspect is correct, it is simply a printing anomaly and nothing more.


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:17 am 
 

It has the yellow/red cloth binding on the spine, which only the true 1st have, according to the entry here.  Would that still constitute a printing anomaly?  



Image

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:20 am 
 

DungeonDelver wrote:It has the yellow/red cloth binding on the spine, which only the true 1st have, according to the entry here. Would that still constitute a printing anomaly?



[ Image ]




Yes, I am saying that the printing anomaly is the fact that the D in Advanced is not running over the edge.  Everything else matches a 1st print. :)


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:22 am 
 

With the exception of the "D" not running over - exactly - this looks like a true first to me.

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:31 am 
 

OH OH...okay, I gotcha now bclarkie. :)  My bad, I thought you were saying it wasn't a first, just a 2nd+ with some anomalies.



Cool. :)



So I have a true 1st with printing anomalies!  Must be in the high 30k's to have gotten an address and logo on the spine...



Thanks so much, y'all!

  

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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:43 am 
 

So is it a True 1st +/- AlphaBeta prerelease?

How do you guys keep up with this stuff?


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:58 am 
 

Deadlord36 wrote:So is it a True 1st +/- AlphaBeta prerelease?

How do you guys keep up with this stuff?




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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 12:16 pm 
 

Is the distance from the A to the D in advanced 2"?



If so, then the font size is the same as other first prints. I think that it is the position of the yellow banner on the book that pulls the D onto the cover.



I'll guess that it is a variation within a print and not a seperate printing.

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:29 pm 
 

ifearyeti wrote:Is the distance from the A to the D in advanced 2"?



If so, then the font size is the same as other first prints. I think that it is the position of the yellow banner on the book that pulls the D onto the cover.



I'll guess that it is a variation within a print and not a seperate printing.




Yes, I just measured it.  2" exactly from the lower left-hand "leg" of the "A" in "ADVANCED" to the outermost edge of the "D" in "ADVANCED".



Printing variation (and probably a unique one) in a revision, looks like.



SO WHAT ARE THE BIDS for this *****L00K SUPER RARE***** ONE-OF-A-KIND OUT OF PRINT BANNED ILLEGAL FORBIDDEN DUNGEN MASTORS GUEID??//1!ONEONE?



;)

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:31 pm 
 

DungeonDelver wrote:ONE-OF-A-KIND


Afraid not.  My T1st is exactly the same.



I've been meaning to mention it for a while.  But just assumed that the "D" could run off the page to varying degrees dependent on the batch printed.  And we got one of those which were better aligned.



Any other thoughts?

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:52 pm 
 

johnhuck wrote:
DungeonDelver wrote:ONE-OF-A-KIND


Afraid not. My T1st is exactly the same.



I've been meaning to mention it for a while. But just assumed that the "D" could run off the page to varying degrees dependent on the batch printed. And we got one of those which were better aligned.



Any other thoughts?




OMG SO GIVING YOU NEG FEEDBACK NOW.



;)



Nope.  Again, the candy-stripe cloth binding plus the not-quite-overrunning D are interesting variations.  Kind of makes me wonder how many out there are like that, now.

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 5:59 pm 
 

I have one where the yellow banner is so high on the cover that it pushes the "D" almost completely off.

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 7:01 pm 
 

johnhuck wrote:
DungeonDelver wrote:ONE-OF-A-KIND


Afraid not. My T1st is exactly the same.



I've been meaning to mention it for a while. But just assumed that the "D" could run off the page to varying degrees dependent on the batch printed. And we got one of those which were better aligned.



Any other thoughts?


Like "oh great!", d'you mean? ;)



Sounds good, John. :)



Spotted a small number possibly similar to those where the banner text appeared to be larger but didn't run off the page/quite so much.

Think I was told over here in one case that the text had probably just been "shifted up a bit" but that otherwise was likely to be a standard printing. That was, however, back before Paul confirmed the 2" measure/1st print issue and sequence thereafter.



=

Good thread. Thanks! :D

  


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Post Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2005 9:32 pm 
 

Sheesh, I go off for work for a few days and things get all muddled up.  That pic is a T1st, and a nice one, too.



How much the "D" runs off the page will depend almost entirely on how much wear the top of the book has taken, in your case, not much.  Period, end of story.  Because of clipped scans, I highly recommend ignoring the top of the book if you're looking for one of these.

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