I am sure that law enforcement is playing it by the book, and I doubt colour/race has anything to do with it. I believe that the majority of people all over the world want to lead safe and decent lives, and wouldn't stop to think before helping someone in need.



That said, why remove medications from people entering shelters? Why prevent them having radios? I can see that you don't wnt guys walking about with knives and guns, and you probably don't want some gang sitting in the corner blaring our gansta rap on their radio. But surely law enforcement can be more sensible? Surely they employ people who have the ability to make a ballanced and rational decision?



I would imagine that the it is easy to 'loose' a news story in the US among the devestation. I also believe that what UK citizens are saying is on the whole truthful. The public returning to the UK are not in if for fame or money. They want to go home and they belive they were treated badly by a disorganised and corrupt force on the grounf in NO.

mbassoc2003 wrote:I am sure that law enforcement is playing it by the book, and I doubt colour/race has anything to do with it. I believe that the majority of people all over the world want to lead safe and decent lives, and wouldn't stop to think before helping someone in need.



That said, why remove medications from people entering shelters? Why prevent them having radios? I can see that you don't wnt guys walking about with knives and guns, and you probably don't want some gang sitting in the corner blaring our gansta rap on their radio. But surely law enforcement can be more sensible? Surely they employ people who have the ability to make a ballanced and rational decision?



I would imagine that the it is easy to 'loose' a news story in the US among the devestation. I also believe that what UK citizens are saying is on the whole truthful. The public returning to the UK are not in if for fame or money. They want to go home and they belive they were treated badly by a disorganised and corrupt force on the grounf in NO.

It's hard for someone from another country to understand why or how this could happen without a history lesson of Louisiana, and there isn't enough space to do it justice (not to mention it's off topic).  Just understand that in probably 49 other states of the US the death toll, damage and incompetence would never have reach the level of something like this in The Big Easy (and they don't call New Orleans the Big Easy because of it's straight arrow, law abiding, diligent ways).  Since the days of Huey Long (The Kingfisher) this state has been a toilet of corruption, haven for illegal activities and bribes, and headquarters of downright violent behavior from both the citizenry and officials combined.  This is the city, several years ago, where over half the police department was indicted by the feds for taking bribes and engaging in illegal activitiy.  Almost every elected official ends their career with a trip to the pen for some kind of illegal activity.  The last three state comptrollers (money and budget handlers) are in prison.  Finally, this is the state that several years ago ran an election for governor that featured the choice of David Duke, KKK member in good standing, and an already criminally convicted politician who ran on the slogan "Elect a Crook instead of the KKK!" (not joking unfortunately).  The crook won and proceeded to get indicted yet again while running the state into the ground.  So please don't judge the rest of the US or even the government response in view of this mess....it's just Louisiana politics as usual.  There are unfortunaely no Rudy Guliani's in the bunch down there.

   So I'm not saying some of the more outlandish and ridiculous urban legend like stories floating around couldn't have happened...but I would take such interesting stories with a grain of salt.  The "Baring the Breasts" story sounds suspiciously like a ready made urban legend, I expect we'll be hearing dozens of variations on it in the next few months.  Besides, I heard President Clinton was working on gathering donations, not in a boat rescuing people (bada boom!)



Mike B.

GraysonAC wrote:

Badmike wrote:Since the days of Huey Long (The Kingfisher) this state has been a toilet of corruption, haven for illegal activities and bribes, and headquarters of downright violent behavior from both the citizenry and officials combined.

NO also has (had) the dubious distinction of being the 'murder capital' of the country, in 2004 being over 10x the national average, and relative to population, dwarfing the murder rates of even LA, Detroit, and NY. There's an inordinate number of bad apples there.

And here I was totally shocked at the fact that people were actually shooting at the rescuers, now it makes more sense.   Without going of on a long tangent(which I did in a now previously deleted post  :) ), I still think that both the federal and state governments could not have dropped the ball any worse than they have. Lets all(myself included ) please get back on topic of worshipping I/O's lair.

A question for you all about defending your life time's collection ......



If there was a natural disaster in your city, you were far away not to be significantly affected. You had fresh water and plenty of food and were in no immediate danger. Wouldn't you stay put?



How would you feel if the US Government told you you had to leave, and leave everything you owned behind?



How would you feel if you faced the next 20 years trying to fight the US Government for compensation for losses they forced you to take? Had to fight corporate insurance giants who are in the business of not paying out?



Is the US Governments policy of 'screw you', disarm them and ship them out, the right one? I thought you guys had rights under the consitiution?

Deadlord36 wrote:Sure, I'd stay put while one of the 4 worst hurricanes in the history of the country proceeded to tear apart my below-sea-level city. Makes perfect sense to me.

I've heard people crying racism, poor government response, poverty, etc. etc. but I have yet to hear a single person say "Thank God I lived through it".

I'm sure there is no racism involved. I'm sure that those who stayed were either extremely brave, extremely stupid or extremely well informed. For most, it was probably a wrong decision and they are now dead.



But then if you are dead or in a house full of sewage I'm sure moving out is not a difficult decision to come to. But what of those who are not devastated, who have food and clean water and are not in danger?



If my RPG room was filled with sewage and my collection was ruined, I have no problem leaving all to float away. But if I'm on dry land and I'm largely untouched, I have too much to move in an emergency. And after the crisis is over, I'd feel pretty agreaved at the home guard telling to to leave my stuff and claim on my insurance, cos they have orders from the government to remove me with force.

GraysonAC wrote:I'd be very interested to hear why you assume racism played no part in anything. NO is(was) a city where violence was spurred by a lot of things, and race is unquestionably one of those things. Do some background reading on some of the reasons that NO had such a high murder rate, and I think you'll find your faith in humanity goes down a notch.

What I meant was, I doubt race was a factor in determining government policy in this matter, or in dictating how police on the ground behave. But then, if experience shows the government and police that they have to make decisions on grounds of race, that being the only way to deal with these people, that's a much more serious problem. In that case I'm glad I live in the UK.

GraysonAC wrote:
I'd be very interested to hear why you assume racism played no part in anything. NO is(was) a city where violence was spurred by a lot of things, and race is unquestionably one of those things. Do some background reading on some of the reasons that NO had such a high murder rate, and I think you'll find your faith in humanity goes down a notch.

    Do you get our Seattle new stations in Vancouver?  



    I don't know how things are in Canada, but here in the US, claims of racism and other sorts or bias are a cottage industry worth hundreds of millions every year.



    There are people who make their living off of nothing else than lawsuits and other crap involving charges of racism.



    Someone with personal motives blaming ____________(insert issue) on racism is so standard in America that we don't usually even listen anymore.  



    Belief in "racists" and other bad people is so common among certain sectors of American society that it closely approximates the belief of the people of 17th century Salem in witchcraft.  



    Remember when Charles II lost some of the Scottish royal treasure on a ferry trip from the Isle of Lewis?  Some old ladies were tried, convicted and executed as the witches responsible for the disaster.



    Same thing here.



   Thus...storm...disaster...resulting problems absolutely MUST = Racism. It is a uniquely American pastime.  

killjoy32 wrote:hey guys, cmon now - we've gone way off topic here...

Cataclysm. Pestelence. Thievery. Tribal warfare. Sounds like a good campaign to me.

mbassoc2003 wrote:A question for you all about defending your life time's collection ......



If there was a natural disaster in your city, you were far away not to be significantly affected. You had fresh water and plenty of food and were in no immediate danger. Wouldn't you stay put?



How would you feel if the US Government told you you had to leave, and leave everything you owned behind?



How would you feel if you faced the next 20 years trying to fight the US Government for compensation for losses they forced you to take? Had to fight corporate insurance giants who are in the business of not paying out?



Is the US Governments policy of 'screw you', disarm them and ship them out, the right one? I thought you guys had rights under the consitiution?

mbass,



I know most Americans have no idea how our system of government works, so I'll give you a pass, too. The U.S. Federal government has absolutely no control over state issues. They cannot issue evacution orders or even tell a state to do it. We have this little thing called a Constitution here and a whole group of laws prescribing state vs. federal authority.



The federal goverment was not in charge at the Superdome - it was all local authorities. Please go back and read some of the other posts describing the incompetence and corruption that runs rampant in that city. The governor actually wanted to hold off on mandatory evac of the city because she wasn't sure the water pollution was a problem!!!! Crap, even that bozo of a mayor could read the writing on the wall by then. Once the feds stepped in, everything has run brilliantly. Yeah, it took them longer than it should have - maybe 24-48 hours max. But considering the extent of the damage was the size of Kansas, I am not as critical as others. The Salvation Army and Red Cross were ready to go in and help, but were told to stay out by local NO authorities because they were assesing the damage...now they want to bitch that everyone showed up too late?!!!



And all those local political morons saying they didn't have time to plan the evac or execute it are lying through their teeth. I live 1,000 miles away and I knew they were gonna get nailed two or three days before. All the news channels were talking about it. And funny how old Miss and Alabama aren't complaining - they were ground zero for the hit!!! No, they have their shit together.