Shady dealers of the past
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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:02 pm 
 

I hate it when sellers say an item is in excellent condition considering it's 20 years old.  That "considering" line is just a way to cover their rear for any mildewed, torn, written in, falling apart condition the item may really be in.

Nice negs btw, BC.

  

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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:11 pm 
 

Here is the item I bought from Buzz810:



** expired/removed eBay auction **


When the item did not arrive for some weeks, I sent him a nice email just checking up on it.  No big deal.  When he did not respond for four or so days, I sent him a followup nicely pointing out that he had not responded.

Here is the reply I got today:


Hello mshipley88,
The package has not returned to us yet. It should be here soon. The tracking still indicates that it is on the way back. We will ship it out the moment that it gets back to us.
Good Bargain Hunting, Buzz810.


Here is a link to this seller's other feedback.  Scroll down a bit and see what the negs and neutrals say:

eBay Feedback Profile for buzz810

I have considered asking him...since he has "tracking" on the package...to send me the tracking number.   :lol:

This isn't a bid deal.  It's only $3 or so and I don't mind waiting.  It would be fine if this guy would just say, "Oh, sorry.  I didn't mail it yet."

This is a good example of how lack of communication and an attempt to seem professional rather than admit mistakes actually hurts a seller.

Mark   8)


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:27 pm 
 

How much is your time actually worth? $10/hour $20/hour or do you bill at a higher rate?
If it's a six-dollar item and you have a .55 listing fee and the item cost you $3 spending more than 10 mins. (really 5min) on the item is a waste of your time.

Sellers have to pack all lots at the same time (this means late payers hold up the process) they have to weigh all the lots at the same time. They have to write all the details at the same time.

Buyers quite often think sellers have an infinite amount of time to work for them and still expect things for a song. I have answered ten questions in the affirmative from morons who then bid $3 on $70 worth of stuff.

The sword cuts both ways, buyers have to be aware of shifty sellers and sellers have to make their efforts worthwhile. Otherwise why not take the stuff to a used book store for credit?

While sellers may do a bit a gouging there has been a parade of "Look what amazing collectable I got for nothing!" on these forums for a long, long time. I wonder how many have then given a kickback to the seller for excellent service? You can pay lip service, but I am guessing the only kickback is positive feedback.

I am in no way defending the guy. The item is either in excellent condition or it isn't. It's not relative to something else. I just wanted to make it clear that it isn't always easy being a seller.

  


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:34 pm 
 

bclarkie wrote:As expected, my email to his response did not go well:

A$$ Hole Seller wrote:Well Brian I do believe our business is concluded


Guess its time for the old chargeback and negative feedback. :roll:  Its really pretty sad to, I haven't had to leave anyone a neg in over a year. :?


The sad part is that I really hate to leave negative feedback.  I think in my 7 1/2 years on EBay, I have left negative feedback a grand total of 5  times, of which 4 of those times the seller in question that I left negative feedback for tried to flat out steal my money.  Another one of those negatives that I  left was in retaliation from a buyer who essentially refused to pay for the items that he bought.  I hadn't even bothered to file NPBs against him and he still neg'd me anyway.

Leaving negativess is really not an option that I take lightly using, but in this circumstance this guy was just a scammer who thought he could pull off some sh*t with me.  I was doing him a favor by offering to return them all for a full refund and not leaving negative feedback. Instead he chose this route rather than just accept the magazines back and reauction them.  Now he is will be out both all of his money and his magazines, and will have nothing but 3 negs to show for it.  Not exactly the brightest bulb in the batch.  

The only bad part of this is I guess that I will have one neg coming my way being that he still has one open feedback, but truthfully and as I will note in my response to it, I am going to wear this neg with pride, based on the transaction. :)


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:42 pm 
 

Icar wrote:How much is your time actually worth? $10/hour $20/hour or do you bill at a higher rate?
If it's a six-dollar item and you have a .55 listing fee and the item cost you $3 spending more than 10 mins. (really 5min) on the item is a waste of your time.

Sellers have to pack all lots at the same time (this means late payers hold up the process) they have to weigh all the lots at the same time. They have to write all the details at the same time.

Buyers quite often think sellers have an infinite amount of time to work for them and still expect things for a song. I have answered ten questions in the affirmative from morons who then bid $3 on $70 worth of stuff.

The sword cuts both ways, buyers have to be aware of shifty sellers and sellers have to make their efforts worthwhile. Otherwise why not take the stuff to a used book store for credit?

While sellers may do a bit a gouging there has been a parade of "Look what amazing collectable I got for nothing!" on these forums for a long, long time. I wonder how many have then given a kickback to the seller for excellent service? You can pay lip service, but I am guessing the only kickback is positive feedback.

I am in no way defending the guy. The item is either in excellent condition or it isn't. It's not relative to something else. I just wanted to make it clear that it isn't always easy being a seller.


I both buy and sell lots on EBay, and I am well aware of how it all works.  I have been doing this for a long time.  If as a seller, it is too time consuming for you to sell your items properly, then IMO, maybe you shouldn't be selling them at all.  If its to difficult to properly sell your item and you insist on selling stuff anyway, then list everything you sell in Poor condition and also indicate that you will make no effort to package the items in away that will insure that they will arrive in good condition.  Set the expectation for your potential buyers that you really don't give a sh*t, and thereofre they will have nothing to complain about when they buy from you.  Granted, it will end up costing you as a seller some cash, but if you can't take the time to sell your items properly, you(in general, not specific) shouldn't really care what the end result is either.  Decide which way you want it, but you can't have it both ways.


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:42 pm 
 

Every negative I have given has been with pride.

  


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:54 pm 
 

Selling to the public and selling to collectors are two different things.
The public are people who will use the item for its original purpose and then pass it on or discard it.
I sell RPG items to RPG players (the public).
On the big ticket items I will make a grading to the best of my ability.

I feel I am doing a service to the RPG community AND clearing my shelves. If you you expect an hour of work when the seller is making $3 you are deluded.

You aren't dealing with walmart, you are dealing with people who have careers, kids, and commitments.

  


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:57 pm 
 

Icar wrote:Selling to the public and selling to collectors are two different things.
The public are people who will use the item for its original purpose and then pass it on or discard it.
I sell RPG items to RPG players (the public).
On the big ticket items I will make a grading to the best of my ability.

I feel I am doing a service to the RPG community AND clearing my shelves. If you you expect an hour of work when the seller is making $3 you are deluded and stupid.

You aren't dealing with walmart, you are dealing with people who have careers, kids, and commitments.


I am not deluded nor am I stupid.  It doesn't take any more than 5 minutes to accurately describe an item in reasonable detail.  As a seller, you are not doing anyone a favor by selling your items, they are doing you a favor by buying them from you.


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 4:04 pm 
 

Once again, if letting your potential buyers know what they are buying is too much work for you thats fine, either don't sell or list everyting in poor condition and deal with the monetary consequenses.  Your "buyers" whether or not they are players or collectors want to know, and quite frankly, deserve to know what they are buying.  Players are less like to be concerned about the condition of the item(s) that you are selling, but that doesn't mean that they won't be dissapointed if the buy something that ends up as garbage.  

There is two sides to every transaction, and just like your time is valuable to you, it is also valuable to your buyers. They also have to go to work and they have to make that same money that they are paying you to buy the items that you are selling.  Its a two way street, just because they are buyers doesn't mean that they have a money tree planted in thier back yard.


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 4:08 pm 
 

MShipley88 wrote:Here is the item I bought from Buzz810:



** expired/removed eBay auction **


When the item did not arrive for some weeks, I sent him a nice email just checking up on it.  No big deal.  When he did not respond for four or so days, I sent him a followup nicely pointing out that he had not responded.

Here is the reply I got today:


Hello mshipley88,
The package has not returned to us yet. It should be here soon. The tracking still indicates that it is on the way back. We will ship it out the moment that it gets back to us.
Good Bargain Hunting, Buzz810.


Here is a link to this seller's other feedback.  Scroll down a bit and see what the negs and neutrals say:

eBay Feedback Profile for buzz810

I have considered asking him...since he has "tracking" on the package...to send me the tracking number.   :lol:

This isn't a bid deal.  It's only $3 or so and I don't mind waiting.  It would be fine if this guy would just say, "Oh, sorry.  I didn't mail it yet."

This is a good example of how lack of communication and an attempt to seem professional rather than admit mistakes actually hurts a seller.

Mark   8)


That is the same shit I got for my item

** expired/removed eBay auction **


So you may get it, but what ever you do don't send it back.

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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 4:10 pm 
 

I don't have a problem with up front high shipping.

Tonya and Titan have high up front costs....but they also have no issues with quality of shipping.  They are a bit deliberate about their shipping process, but they attach a tracking number to every item....and Bob's your uncle!

I have issues with hidden charges and misleading listings.

One thing bclarkie didn't tell us was whether or not these came with combined shipping charges....for instance...did he pay $6 each or was it all shipped for a charge of $6.  Even for $6, the seller should have tossed in a piece of cardboard.

IF the shipping charge was only $6, then it compounds the seller's behavior.  For $6 he got three negs.

Also, the seller's answer tends to indicate that he knew the items were in bad condition before he mailed them...probably that one of the covers was already detached and torn in half.

Bclarkie paid over $26 for all three (which would be a quite large purchase for me and a lot of other buyers) not counting shipping.  All three were listed as "excellent" condition.  $26 + $6 = $32.  

Minus the $2.67 for shipping and $0.25 for the envelope, this seller got $29 for the transaction.  Now minus out $6 for Ebay and PayPal fees and the seller netted about $23 for his time...and that includes sharply rounding down the figures bclarkie paid for all three items.

   $23...am I about right?

   I figure about three hours of work to list, communicate, pack and mail these items...which could be slightly high or low.

   Thus, his spare-time hobby/job (37 total feedbacks and 55 total items sold) paid him $7.66 per hour.  These are dishwasher wages, but this does not include other items he processed at the same time and should take into account the sideline nature of his business.

   The seller made foolish choices in how he deceptively listed the items, how he did the shipping and how he responded to bclarkie's complaint.  He should have paid attention both to how he was doing busines and who he was dealing with (hints about bclarkie's relative collector status were only a button click away).

    The seller alienated a prime customer.  He got three negs.  He got his name on this list.  Not bad for three hours of work.

Mark   8)


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 4:41 pm 
 

Icar wrote:Selling to the public and selling to collectors are two different things.
The public are people who will use the item for its original purpose and then pass it on or discard it.
I sell RPG items to RPG players (the public).
On the big ticket items I will make a grading to the best of my ability.

I feel I am doing a service to the RPG community AND clearing my shelves. If you you expect an hour of work when the seller is making $3 you are deluded.

You aren't dealing with walmart, you are dealing with people who have careers, kids, and commitments.


All a seller has to do, even a casual one, is to make up a list of a few different ratings (say, Near Mint, Excellent, Very Good, Good, Poor) and list a few pertinent pieces of information about why each description fits, then cut and paste the descriptions on all his listings.  Then give the listing a rating.  That way, when the seller wants to communicate that the item has the cover falling off, he can say the item is in "Poor" condition and refer to his description list where under "Poor" it may say "Cover is probably falling off item".  It doesn't take more than five seconds to do this, and it alleviates a lot of guessing. That's why to me the seller is just simply dishonest, there is no way Excellent can be construed to mean "cover is off the item" unless you are lying to make a sale.  Believe me, I've had worse...the lady who listed a group of magazines as "near mint" and they had the covers falling off.  Happily, she did take the magazines back and gave me a full refund, and I did notice when she relisted them the "Near Mint" condition rating disappeared.  In that case I chalked it up to just not paying attention, there didn't seem to be any malice involved.
    It's gotten so bad I see tons of listings with absolutely no descriptions except an out of focus or hard to see digital photo.  Why bid on something like that?  In my experience, someone's ability or effort to describe their item is in direct proportion to how good of shape the item is in. I'm not playing the lotto here, why take a chance, plus I've had way too many items that looked ok in the photo turn out to be terrible in person.  If a seller wants to scrimp on the description, then he should be prepared to make the ocassional refund.

Mike B.


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Post Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 5:18 pm 
 

Grading is nice but when you are trying to turn over 40-50 items in a weekend you can screw up easily. I usually write" nice copy" if a module is in noteworthy condition…

I had sold a copy of one of the desert series. I had even gone through it to look for pen and pencil marks. It was clean. I flipped the pages just before packing it up and I had missed the part where someone had taken a razor to some the back pages. Had I known it had damaged pages I wouldn't have sold it at all, or I would have sold it in a junk lot. So I sucked it up and sent the guy a mint copy. Not that everyone has extra mint copies lying around though.

If you want to grade items well it takes time. It's serious business, and for me this is just a fun hobby. I luck out occasionally, but usually I get what I pay for.

  

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Post Posted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 4:18 am 
 

An update on the highly gripping Buzz810 story.  

There has been a break in the case:

Hello mshipley88,
Sorry to be behind in things. The package was returned to us and we have reshipped the book out. Thank you for being patient on this. Please let us know when the package arrives or if any other problems arrise.
Good bargain hunting, Buzz810.


Wow, they got it back.  What a relief!   :lol:

He could have just said, "I didn't mail it yet...OK, now I did," and that would have been fine.

Stay tuned!

Mark   :lol:


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Post Posted: Sat Aug 05, 2006 5:09 am 
 

MShipley88 wrote:An update on the highly gripping Buzz810 story.  

There has been a break in the case:

Hello mshipley88,
Sorry to be behind in things. The package was returned to us and we have reshipped the book out. Thank you for being patient on this. Please let us know when the package arrives or if any other problems arrise.
Good bargain hunting, Buzz810.


Wow, they got it back.  What a relief!   :lol:

He could have just said, "I didn't mail it yet...OK, now I did," and that would have been fine.

Stay tuned!

Mark   :lol:


hey mark

its funny that you should have that happen to you. i bought a load of con pre-reg books n stuff and the parcel got returned to the seller ! they then contacted me and sent it again and i received it this time. shipping was $50+ so that musta been an expensive op for the seller there. but total thumbs up from me to see a seller follow through at that level to the expense of themselves!

Al


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Post Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 5:50 am 
 

There is a happy ending to the Buzz810 story.  The item arrived as ordered.

The seller mailed the item on August 3rd, and he had Delivery Confirmation on the package.

August 3rd, of course, is the day he emailed me to say that the package had not come in yet and when it did they would mail it out again right away.

So, if the seller somehow got and remailed the package on the same day, then his story could be true.

Given that he sent me a "remailed" message on the 5th....?

I don't think that this guy is shady so much as just careless with getting things in the mail...a crime I too have committed.

Mark   8)


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Post Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:56 am 
 

I am still waiting on mine from Buzz810....

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... %3AIT&rd=1

Too little to waste PayPal and not large enought to risk the return neg. If I dont get it I will have to fo the last minute neg deal. That being said I feel like even that is wasting more time and effort than the money spent. Better just to never do business with again and write it off as a learning experience.


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Post Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:10 am 
 

Marlith wrote:If I dont get it I will have to fo the last minute neg deal.


Careful there. I waited 90 days exactly (down to the last half-hour), posted a neg, and then on day 92 (!) the bum seller neg'd me back.

Either eB changed that 90-day thing or it's not counting from the date of sale. (Praps from the date of payment?)

  
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