KingOfPain wrote:Maybe the mod should lock the thread since there really is no debate on the original post any longer.
mbassoc2003 wrote: OB3 has been available free from WoTC for the past four years and the price of an original is astronomical,
Marlith wrote:mbassoc2003 wrote: OB3 has been available free from WoTC for the past four years and the price of an original is astronomical, Ok I have to know. Not familiar with OB3. Can't find it on the TSR archive. Sorry for go off topic for a moment but I am just not familiar with that particular item.
Marlith wrote::?: Ok I have to know. Not familiar with OB3. Can't find it on the TSR archive. Sorry for go off topic for a moment but I am just not familiar with that particular item.
mbassoc2003 wrote:...I think there has been no impact on the market.OB3 has been available free from WoTC for the past four years and the price of an original is astronomical, and ST1 has been available free on Kazaa for just as long. The Dragon Magazine Archive is going up in price, and the magazines themeselves are not depreciating.
mbassoc2003 wrote:All moral and legal issues aside, I don't think we can rely on the copyright holders of ST1 and other more bazaar and remote publications like Owl & Weasel or Lair of the Spider Mother to prevent the product disappearing into history unrecorded. If someone doesn't PDF them, sooner or later they will be gone.
harami2000 wrote:There's a degree of truth in that, no doubt.Whereas it might be hoped that the rarities might end up in collections there's a chance many copies will just be trashed. Was talking with someone recently who simply threw out their run of Trollcrushers, because they didn't like them, and casually gave away their first twenty-odd O&Ws.
KingOfPain wrote:I am not going to make too serious of a post here because 1) I dont have the necessary knowledge of federal law to really make any specific argument, and 2) I am guilty of breaking those laws from time to time. The two cents I did want to put in were simply that I dont think that having .PDF's of current and out-of-print items is a major issue as it pertains to the market price of the actual item. The only example I can really make is I.C.E.'s MERP line. Several years ago, almost all of the MERP items were available for download for free on News — MERP .com Middle-earth Role Playing Tolkien RPG Community Website. They were eventually pulled because of licensing issues. I believe that the owners of the website thought the PDF's were legal because Iron Crown no longer existed but I dont have all the details. Basically they were asked to cease and desist or face a lawsuit. I had spent a good amount of time downloading the entirety of the MERP titles available along with thousands of other people before they were pulled from the site. I still have them and enjoy reading the content once in awhile.Do I feel bad about owning them? Of course not. No one is getting hurt and no one is making money from them. I dont believe they hurt the collectability of the MERP line either. The last few years have seen the prices for most MERP items on Ebay skyrocket. I myself have bought several MERP items for what I thought were decent prices so it is not like I dont plan on buying anymore of them just because I have the PDF.Now if I was putting them all on disk and trying to sell the disk on Ebay for a profit, I would expect a severe ass-kicking for that.
mbassoc2003 wrote: So maybe I could PDF your rares?
mbassoc2003 wrote:harami2000 wrote:There's a degree of truth in that, no doubt.Whereas it might be hoped that the rarities might end up in collections there's a chance many copies will just be trashed. Was talking with someone recently who simply threw out their run of Trollcrushers, because they didn't like them, and casually gave away their first twenty-odd O&Ws.So maybe I could PDF your rares?
zhowar1 wrote:mbassoc2003 wrote: So maybe I could PDF your rares? mbassoc - I appreciate what you are doing with making archival pdfs of obscure items.
harami2000 wrote:They're not "archival copies", they're "personal copies" (many/mostly of items which are then re-sold).
zhowar1 wrote:I appreciate your point, but an "archive" is just a "a place or collection containing records, documents, or other materials of historical interest", whether it's personal or municipal, private or public...
radagast wrote:Marlith wrote: Ok I have to know. Not familiar with OB3. Can't find it on the TSR archive. Sorry for go off topic for a moment but I am just not familiar with that particular item. Orange B3. the original edition of the "Palace of the silver princess" Page Not Foundavailable for the download onhttp://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/downloadsCheersGiorgio
Marlith wrote: Ok I have to know. Not familiar with OB3. Can't find it on the TSR archive. Sorry for go off topic for a moment but I am just not familiar with that particular item.
Marlith wrote: I am really not all that big a neophyte though I sometimes seem to fit the part
harami2000 wrote:Surely there would be less danger of "the product disappearing into history unrecorded" if those were circulated widely, rather than reserved on a single individual's PC?
harami2000 wrote:(I'm also fairly certain that the .pdfs made before the items were sold-on weren't watermarked or subjected to minor edits/changes, either, in an attempt to reduce the impact on the original items).
zhowar1 wrote:Yes, of course. My use of "archival" was just in reference to mbassoc's *personal* archival copies. My understanding is that he won't distribute them because of copyright. But the copyright will eventually expire, and in my opinion it's a good idea to make scans now before the items age any further.
bclarkie wrote:I think that you probably missed David's original point. It is still a copyright violation to buy something, make a personal copy for yourself and the sell off the original.
