Back when D & D was evil...

Posts: 342 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 12:51 pm

Badmike wrote:

But then again Stalinism is ALSO responsible for millions of deaths....and in only 50 years of history. Let's don't even get into Mao's "purges". Religious fanaticism can't be blamed for all the world's massacres.

I agree with the sentiment....but religions also lead to charities, schools, hospitals and more. This coming from someone that sets foot in church....well, never. Ok, weddings and funerals.

The minds at my wife's church may be controlled, but they are motivated towards peaceful and helpful ends. But you are right the "deeper" someone gets into a religion, the more forceful his/her presentation will be. Is this just me, or does anyone else notice these types tend to "burn out" in a period of time? I actually know a couple of former hard core holy roller types that are now burnt out, disillusioned, morally bankrupt athiests/agnostics, only decades removed from their glory days.

Bringing it back to D&D, does anyone else notice that pencil and paper games tend to be overlooked, or considerd "quaint" to those who now spend their fury on violent video games? Shouldn't D&D be as demonic as ever, no matter what the medium? I'm disappointed that now our game has lost it's "edge".... Sad

Mike B.

I am always happy to see quality over quantity. D&D will probaly be considered even more suspect and demonic because it requires people to read, and reading has always been the mark of evil.

Posts: 2635 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 12:53 pm

Badmike wrote:

Shouldn't D&D be as demonic as ever, no matter what the medium? I'm disappointed that now our game has lost it's "edge".... Sad

Just because you've got a bunch of virgins and a table, doesn't mean you've got a demonic ceremony. Wink

Posts: 1200 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 12:56 pm

Badmike wrote:

Bringing it back to D&D, does anyone else notice that pencil and paper games tend to be overlooked, or considerd "quaint" to those who now spend their fury on violent video games? Shouldn't D&D be as demonic as ever, no matter what the medium? I'm disappointed that now our game has lost it's "edge".... Sad

Mike B.

I was always surprised that D&D was the target during the 1980's and games like Call of Cthulhu was ignored.
Of course D&D and role-playing were interchangeable terms during that period.
Anybody reporting on the story probably did not want to complicate the issue for their readers/viewers.

Posts: 3999 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:06 pm

Deadlord39 wrote:

So does the Bible, although not as openly as the Quran.

This is a misunderstanding of some sort. The Bible does not say that.

Posts: 1200 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:25 pm

FormCritic wrote:

This is a misunderstanding of some sort. The Bible does not say that.

Exodus 22:20 "Whoever sacrifices to any god other than the lord must be destroyed."

Acts 3:23 "And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear the prophet, shall be destroyed."

2 Chronicles 15:13 "All who would not seek the lord, the god of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman."

EDIT: Are we off topic enough yet? Razz

Posts: 1756 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:44 pm

deimos3428 wrote:

Just because you've got a bunch of virgins and a table, doesn't mean you've got a demonic ceremony. Wink

... but add in some chocolate sauce and you have a whole evening of fun Very Happy

Posts: 1756 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

jasonw1239 wrote:

EDIT: Are we off topic enough yet? Razz

Posts quoting scripture is a good sign that we may need a map and compass to get back to topic Smile

.

The truth is that people have often used religion to advance their own political ecomomic or cultural views - and that has more to do with what they want and less about what a particular interpretation of a religious text or church doctrine. For example; I grew up in Northern Ireland - where what we referred to as the 'troubles' were widely chacterised as a religious war. BUT that was in fact far from the truth, and the proof of that is that the peace and some measure of agreement which has now been established - was done as a political settlement, without anyone having to swap creed or change their views about transubstantiation. Wink

Posts: 610 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:57 pm

Deadlord39 wrote:

Those are some fucked-up people, Jason.
It's been my experience that the more deeply religious a person is, the more likely he/she is to attempt to cram their beliefs down others' throats, in whatever way possible.

Was mother Teresa religious or spiritual or neither or both? What about Mahatma Ghandi? Martin Luther King, Jr.? Yes, there are some messed up people who are fundamentalists, and there are also some wonderful people who were shaped by their beliefs.

However, when religion consumes people to the point that they allow an agenda to to be more important than respect, I don't like it. I will never argue that there isn't bad religion out there. That's obvious.

Again, do we judge religion by the best it has to offer or the worst? Not that we weigh one against the other, but is what good religion has to offer so good that it's worth embracing?

Posts: 1200 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:00 pm

red_bus wrote:

Posts quoting scripture is a good sign that we may need a map and compass to get back to topic Smile

.

The truth is that people have often used religion to advance their own political ecomomic or cultural views - and that has more to do with what they want and less about what a particular interpretation of a religious text or church doctrine. For example; I grew up in Northern Ireland - where what we referred to as the 'troubles' were widely chacterised as a religious war. BUT that was in fact far from the truth, and the proof of that is that the peace and some measure of agreement which has now been established - was done as a political settlement, without anyone having to swap creed or change their views about transubstantiation. Wink

One of the best lines I heard about religion in Northern Ireland was the tourist that was traveling through who was asked what his religion was.
He said "I am an atheist."
The person who had asked the question thought for a moment and replied "Yes, but are you a Catholic atheist or a Protestant atheist?" Razz

Posts: 1756 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:17 pm

Yup, pretty much. Very Happy

Posts: 610 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:20 pm

Atheists may be reviled in some quarters, but I personally believe they have more faith than most people. And they are usually quite knowledgeable abut all kinds of religious stuff. Interesting people.

Posts: 1200 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:24 pm

Atheism is not a matter of belief or faith.
It is the absence of a belief in the supernatural. Period. Smile

Posts: 610 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:42 pm

jasonw1239 wrote:

Atheism is not a matter of belief or faith.
It is the absence of a belief in the supernatural. Period. Smile

I have a hard time believing that after talking to many atheists. They are quite good at outlining what they don't believe and why. And they are usually quite intelligent...more intelligent than me. Your definition may be technically correct, but to hear these people speak is quite amazing. Many have extensive experiences with religion and/or the spiritual which has shaped them. It is common to find they have rejected religion and it is common to find passion in their convictions. More passion than many people who state they are believers in one religion or another.

I have also met people who don't believe in much of anything spiritual or religious. They don't call themselves atheists. For lack of a better word, I call them apathists. They are simply apathetic about belief. They are not bad people, they just haven't been around much of anything religious or spiritual.

That's just my experience.

Posts: 1200 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 4:50 pm

There is often confusion between atheism and agnosticism.
Many people reject the religion of their parents and call themselves atheists.
If you closely examine their personal beliefs they are still sitting on the fence and therefore agnostics.

Posts: 3191 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 5:15 pm

I'm an Atheist.
Not sure I'm intelligent, but who knows Wink

ShaneG.

Posts: 3999 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 6:10 pm

Posts: 342 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 6:17 pm

jasonw1239 wrote:

Atheism is not a matter of belief or faith.
It is the absence of a belief in the supernatural. Period. Smile

It is an absolutest viewpoint which makes as much or as little sense as any other absolutest viewpoint.

Posts: 4716 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:09 pm

I'm definitely not atheist, nor agnostic. I refuse to waste time with any sort of dogma, since none of it can be proven. Whatever comes afterwards, comes afterwards. For all anyone knows, we are an experiment in a universe-sized petrie dish.
I guess I'm a don't-give-a-shitist.

Posts: 342 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:12 pm

Deadlord39 wrote:

I'm definitely not atheist, nor agnostic. I refuse to waste time with any sort of dogma, since none of it can be proven. Whatever comes afterwards, comes afterwards. For all anyone knows, we are an experiment in a universe-sized petrie dish.
I guess I'm a don't-give-a-shitist.

The first step to true wisdom

Posts: 610 · Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:55 pm

I admire people who give a shit, especially if that means they care about life, the world, and the rest of humanity. It's not that I'm against or look down on those who don't give a shit, but it takes work, and thought, and courage. Of course, some people who give a shit are creepy or evil or annoying or crazy, but that can come with the territory. Plus, caring can get you killed. I try to care but it's difficult. Confused

I apologize for digressing from the original topic.